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Thursday, December 6, 2007 | Reason : Political | print version Print | Comments

Video Riding with Rocinante: 'It's me or the crucifix'

CBC

Thanks to Mark for the link.

Reposted from:
http://www.cbc.ca/news/reportsfromabroad/murray/20071204.html

On one side of the Atlantic sits Lord Black. On the other, Judge Luigi Tosti. Both are convicted criminals, both proclaim their cause and their innocence.

Lord Black needs little introduction, but perhaps you haven't heard of Judge Tosti. He's leading a lonely crusade against the crucifix and it is being fought in Italy, in the Vatican's backyard.

Italy, of course, has been the world headquarters of the Roman Catholic church and the birthplace of all but the two most recent popes for the past nearly 500 years. The church's influence, its servants, its symbols are woven into the fabric of Italian life.

Sixty years ago, Italy was a defeated country, a fascist state crushed in the rubble of the Allied victory against Nazi Germany and its allies. Under the influence and guidance of the Americans, the Italians drew up a new constitution.

Like the American model, it proclaimed the government to be secular. Church and state would not mix. A fine principle, but no one seemed to notice or care.

Judge Tosti himself never noticed during a quarter century on the Italian bench in the small city of Rimini on the Adriatic coast. It was only, well, let the judge explain:

"Some lawyers casually pointed out a prominent crucifix [on the wall of his courtroom]. I had never noticed it before. I took the crucifix off the wall. I then discovered that the Italian Supreme Court had ruled in 2000 that crucifixes should be removed from all public offices because they go against the state's secular character. That's when I wrote a letter to the minister of justice."

Declaration of war

The minister, in the then right-wing government of billionaire prime minister Silvio Berlusconi, didn't reply. Judge Tosti decided to force the issue.

He brought a Jewish menorah into his courtroom and accorded it equal pride of place. Still no reaction. And so, in 2005, Judge Tosti announced he wouldn't work in a courtroom with a crucifix on the wall.

Italian justice suddenly swung into action. Judge Tosti was investigated, charged, tried and convicted of dereliction of duty. His sentence was seven months in prison, suspended.

When I met the judge recently, he was preparing to attend his appeal hearing. He's an unbending atheist, proud of the support he's received from the Italian Atheist Society, a small band that has tried and failed to remove crucifixes from school classrooms.

The judge-crusader sees the real enemy in his war as the power behind the throne — the Vatican.

"I have no hard feelings towards the Catholic church," he says. "Actually, I do because it regards itself as the repository of truth and expects to enjoy special favours because of that."

Then, the declaration of war: "The Catholic church has committed crimes against humanity." The judge lists the Inquisition, the crusades and ill treatment of the Jews over centuries.

Such harsh language isn't designed to make his appeal any easier. But Judge Tosti denies that he sees himself as a latter-day St. Sebastian.

"It's not that I have any notions of becoming a martyr. And certainly, in other times, I would have already been burned at the stake. Times have gotten better.

"My battle — a battle which I fight utterly alone, like Don Quixote — has, in the last couple of years, created debate in Italy about the Church's constant meddling."

Look out, windmills

The judge exaggerates, perhaps. When he appeared before the three-man appeal court, the only media organization in attendance was the CBC. The debate in Italy is, at best, muffled.

One of Judge Tosti's most visible opponents is a senior senator, once a cabinet minister in the Berlusconi government. His name is Marcello Pera. He is tall and silver-haired, the very picture of a senator.

He is also a lapsed Catholic, a man who doesn't believe in God or the resurrection of Jesus, a lapsed Catholic who is somehow a friend of the present Pope Benedict XVI. Such a friend, in fact, that they've written a book together. Their mutual target is secularism.

Pera defends crucifixes on the walls of courtrooms by describing them as part of a "motivational myth." It's important, he argues, to defend that myth in public institutions.

"It reminds you that you have to be liberal, you have to be democratic. You may not believe that we are created in the image of God but that myth, if you will, explains why we all see ourselves as equal. It gives you the most important foundation of the democratic state."

What's more, Pera contends, the crucifix acts as a rampart in the ideological struggle against Islam.

The wheels of justice

Faced with that complicated logic, which ties together believers and unbelievers, Judge Tosti stood before his judges in the appeal court.

They seemed more interested in a political rather than a judicial solution. The chief justice suggested that Judge Tosti could be allowed to go back to work in a crucifix-free courtroom. Judge Tosti was outraged.

"This is an offensive proposal. It's ghettoization. It's worse than being forced to hold court with a crucifix on the wall."

And so the appeal court justices retired to consider their verdict and whether they might order the crucifixes removed from public buildings, as the constitution appears to suggest. That was months ago.

Judge Tosti understands how the game is played. He's almost 60. He expects his case to be dragged out with the representatives of the state hoping he will throw in the towel and go into retirement rather than lose his pension.

He has no intention of doing that.

He says he'll take his crusade to the Italian Supreme Court and then to the European Court of Human Rights if necessary.

"It's me or the crucifix," he says.

Comments 1 - 14 of 14 |

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1. Comment #94782 by artemisa on December 6, 2007 at 2:16 pm

Another hero. BRAVO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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2. Comment #94783 by 82abhilash on December 6, 2007 at 2:19 pm


"It's me or the crucifix," he says.


Actually it is more like me on the crucifix. They are trying to make sure that he slowly bleeds to death (metaphorically) while dragging their feet on this case.

Other Comments by 82abhilash

3. Comment #94786 by decius on December 6, 2007 at 2:25 pm

 avatarJudge Tosti will appear again in court tomorrow . A sit-in of protest is planned in front of the tribunal. If someone from Rome is reading this and is willing to participate, the demonstration will take place in Piazza Indipendenza at 9am. Needless to say, Tosti needs all the support that he can get.

More information (in Italian) is available at http://uaarroma.altervista.org/index.php

Signatures are being collected by the French Brights

brightsfrance@free.fr

Specify last name, first Name, credentials, area (city, state/province, country,)

More info (in English) available here http://brightsfrance.free.fr/tostienglish.htm

Other Comments by decius

4. Comment #94789 by Socrates on December 6, 2007 at 2:39 pm

 avatarI wish Judge Tosti the best in this noble political battle!

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5. Comment #94791 by thirdchimpanzee on December 6, 2007 at 2:57 pm

I'm confused by the link to brightsfrance - which refers to events from 2005. It seems Judge Tosti served his 7 months in 2006, and is now presumably waiting out the 1 year suspension. Did this case get to the European Court of Human Rights? What exactly is happening tomorrow with the Tribunal in Rome - knowing no Italian, but recognising words that have English equivalents it looks as though it's to do with the suspension.

Looks like Italy has its own version of our (US) culture wars. In the same way that we have to put up with "In God We Trust" tacked on to the currency in the 1950's, the Italians have to put up with this nonsense imposed by two fascist regimes - Mussolini and the Vatican.

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6. Comment #94794 by decius on December 6, 2007 at 3:05 pm

 avatar@thirdchimpanzee

Tomorrow Tosti will appear in front of the Consiglio Superiore della Magistratura, an internal organ of the Ministry of Justice, which has the power to remove him from his job or to discipline him otherwise through a trial-like procedure.

I am actually not sure if the French Brights are still collecting signatures, but it would appear so, as the site is still on-line.



Other Comments by decius

7. Comment #94798 by EvolvedDNA on December 6, 2007 at 3:21 pm

This is certainly a breath of fresh air compared to some of the videos we have seen this week on this site. The crucifix is symbolic of Jesus in one way at least.. hanging about all day and achieving nothing.

Other Comments by EvolvedDNA

8. Comment #94799 by thirdchimpanzee on December 6, 2007 at 3:24 pm

Thanks decius.

What exactly is his "crime" - refusing to sit in a courtroom with a crucifix, or making a fuss about it? How can this case be elevated to the European Court - where hopefully sanity will prevail. They're the ones who forced the British to stop torturing IRA prisoners - to the benefit of both parties.

Other Comments by thirdchimpanzee

9. Comment #94802 by decius on December 6, 2007 at 3:31 pm

 avatarI don't know, really, thirdchimpanzee. I left Italy in disgust 20 years ago and I get my info second-hand.

For those who have watched the video, don't be fooled by the self-serving public declarations of "atheism" put forward by the scumbags Pera and Ferrara. They don't even fall under Dennett's description of "believers in belief". They are notorious pseudo-intellectuals on Vatican's payroll, acting as Trojan horses in the Italian political theater. Pera was chairman of the senate in Berlusconi's government. Both underwent huge ideological leaps in their careers and can be bought to endorse any position. Ferrara started out as a communist and even publicly admitted to have pocketed CIA money at some point. They represent Italian corruption at its worst.

Other Comments by decius

10. Comment #94823 by treeman17 on December 6, 2007 at 5:22 pm

 avatarPersonalmente, questo è imbarazzante che un professore, quando dice che anche se non esiste dio, è nonostante importante difendere il suo mito, può abbassare la sua testa così vicino alla terra che l'unica cosa che vede è la merda. Il mito di Giove fa pure una parte della tradizione in questa area geografica, è questo un'altra illusione da difendere?

Inoltre, condannare un giudice per il delitto di difendere la costituzione è una vergogna insopportabile. Questa è solo un'altra prova che fra troppi politici, assecondare il Vaticano in questo paese è ancora più importante dei diritti del'umanità.

I felt it necessary to post my response in Italian since I call this county my home. Bablefish makes a decent translation, but if copy and paste sounds like too much work, I'll translate.

Other Comments by treeman17

11. Comment #94874 by alfonso on December 6, 2007 at 11:41 pm

Agreed, treeman17, it is embarrassing to see ANYONE defend a myth just because others hold it dear, a myth is a myth, and as such should be known by everyone.

Other Comments by alfonso

12. Comment #94957 by Incredulous on December 7, 2007 at 3:48 am

I am totally confused!! This professional, hardworking professional is being abused because he believes the law should not have any bias towards any individual or group, right?

Am I right in being led to believe that this ordinary man is being attacked by the system for trying to uphold the values of that system?

This man is beng tried for ensuring that everyone is actually seen as being equal before the eyes of the law, if not before the imaginary eyes of our imaginary myth making mythological beast?

How do we, in Europe and the USA stop this degenerate sliede into this murky, degenerate mess?

Other Comments by Incredulous

13. Comment #95144 by glittergulch on December 7, 2007 at 12:41 pm

 avatarI love the "atheist" journalist defending the cross in the courtroom: "Hey, I wouldn't complain if I was in Saudi Arabia and I saw some muslim stuff." Yeah, that's what a first world European nation hopes to become: As modern as Saudi Arabia.

Other Comments by glittergulch

14. Comment #115410 by salgiambruno on January 24, 2008 at 6:59 am

 avatarBravo Tosti!

The way I am interpreting this story is that what the defenders of crucifixes are basically arguing is that, if the cultural space currently occupied by Catholicism (Christianity) in Italy were to become a neutral space, and the government were to relinquish any bias it may keep as to what religion may occupy that space, then any other religions would have the opportunity to fill that space, so to speak.

That's a weak argument for keeping crucifixes and religion intertwined with a secular government. Why not instead neutralize the religious bias altogether, and fill the space with real secular values? Must that space be necessarily occupied by values that are seen to be derived from some religion or another? Why can those values not be disassociated from religion and be claimed secular instead? After all, values and morality, though thought by some to derive from God and Religion are in fact human, secular products.

To Incredulous:

Tosti is being tried because he is taking a stand to defend the Italian constitution. The court was willing to accomodate him by providing him with a separate courtroom which did not have a crucifix, but Tosti wouldn't be satisfied with that. In principle, he argues that all symbols of religion should be removed.

As an Italian-born myself, I would be emabarassed a great deal more about the two-faced nature of the Atheist professor had I not been comforted in the knowledge that Italy is progressing towards secularism much more rapidly than the U.S.

Goodness be to Mithra!

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