Thursday, October 23, 2008 | Reason : In the News | print version

Print | Comments |

'Probably' the best atheist bus campaign ever

by Ariane Sherine, guardian.co.uk

Thank you! Now you've made the campaign such an extraordinary success, we all need to think about what to do next

Thank you so much to everyone who has donated to the atheist bus campaign. As I write this, the total has just broken £83,000 (without Gift Aid) – a truly amazing amount to raise in just two days (even the donation website, JustGiving, told us they've never experienced this much support for a campaign before!). You've helped us hit the national news headlines, give atheists more of a voice, and generate debate on TV, radio and newspapers throughout the world. It couldn't have happened without you, and we're extremely grateful for all your support.

There's been an exciting level of debate about the campaign. Lots of you have asked why the word "probably" is included in the ad slogan, and stated that you'd prefer the wording to read "There's no God". While I fully understand this view, there's a vital reason for the "probably"'s inclusion: as with the Carlsberg ads, it's likely to get us around the advertising regulations (specifically points 3.1, 3.2, 5.1, 8.1, 9.1 and 11.1 in the general rules of the CAP Code, which regulates non-broadcast adverts in the UK). In my view, neither version of the slogan breaches the code, but CAP has advised that "the inclusion of the word 'probably' makes it less likely to cause offence, and therefore be in breach of the Advertising Code."

There's another reason I'm keen on the "probably": it means the slogan is more accurate, as even though there's no scientific evidence at all for God's existence, it's also impossible to prove that God doesn't exist (or that anything doesn't). As Richard Dawkins states in The God Delusion, saying "there's no God" is taking a "faith" position. He writes: "Atheists do not have faith; and reason alone could not propel one to total conviction that anything definitely does not exist". His choice of words in the book is "almost certainly"; but while this is closer to what most atheists believe, "probably" is shorter and catchier, which is helpful for advertising. I also think the word is more lighthearted, and somehow makes the message more positive.

Many people have asked how the extra funds are going to be used. While everyone on the campaign team is elated at the amount raised, we genuinely never expected the campaign to skyrocket like this, and had only planned to use any extra money to buy small ads inside buses. We're hoping to run the campaign throughout the UK, but outside London we may have to think about using billboards and trains instead of buses, since the company Stagecoach runs many regional bus services and may not accept our adverts as its owner, Brian Souter, is an evangelical Christian.

Whatever happens, every penny of the total is going directly towards the atheist adverts. If you have an innovative idea about how we could advertise more effectively outside London, an atheist advertising slogan you like which we could use in future campaigns, or a thought about where we should take the campaign from here, please let us know – we'll read every comment.

Lastly, thank you once again to everyone who has given to the campaign, commented in a debate, blogged about it, linked to a site or story about it, joined the Facebook group, forwarded links to friends, or posted a funny, kind or supportive comment on the JustGiving page. Atheists have truly pulled together to make ourselves heard, and it's exciting to imagine what we could achieve in the future. The sky's the limit, and as one comment on the donation page said: "I hope this is just the beginning."

To donate to the atheist bus campaign, please visit here.

Posted: Thursday, October 23, 2008 | Permalink

Comments 1 - 50 of 674 |

Reload Comments | Back to Top | Page Numbers

1. Comment #270185 by debacles on October 23, 2008 at 7:47 pm

can't wait to see the backlash

Other Comments by debacles

2. Comment #270187 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 7:48 pm

I have no problem with the use of the word "probably", and the reasons offered for its usage (marketing, the UK's "offense" laws) make sense to me.

I just wish you (or someone) would run the same advertisements over here in the US where it is likely to have a bigger impact. Or at least cause a much bigger media frenzy :)

Other Comments by Don_Quix

3. Comment #270190 by RightWingAtheist on October 23, 2008 at 7:52 pm

I rather like the mellow statement.

But if anyone is worried that it doesn't have enough "punch", earlier today Fox News was summarizing it as a plot to "kill God."

Other Comments by RightWingAtheist

4. Comment #270193 by RightWingAtheist on October 23, 2008 at 7:54 pm

And if any moderate atheists shy from the "A-word", can I suggest "Probabilist" as an alternative?

Other Comments by RightWingAtheist

5. Comment #270194 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 7:55 pm

But if anyone is worried that it doesn't have enough "punch", earlier today Fox News was summarizing it as a plot to "kill God."

Hahah. I saw that, and it made me smile. It was even one of the minor headlines on foxnews.com. It probably would have been the banner headline for a week if the ads had been run in Utah or Kansas.

Other Comments by Don_Quix

6. Comment #270198 by Kiwi on October 23, 2008 at 8:01 pm

How about sponsoring a high profile sportsperson ? Runner in the London marathon, tennis player, footballer or football advertisement ?

Other Comments by Kiwi

7. Comment #270199 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 8:01 pm

Oh noes, the nasty atheist are going to murder poor innocent god with bad words.

What shall we ever do??

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

8. Comment #270204 by RightWingAtheist on October 23, 2008 at 8:07 pm

How about a NASCAR car with a Red A?

Other Comments by RightWingAtheist

9. Comment #270205 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 8:07 pm

Ariane

Though the ad campaign is in itself a wonderful step in the right direction, your own eloquent and passionate support for our collective atheist endeavour is of enormous value.

Thank you.

Best,
Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

10. Comment #270206 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 8:08 pm

Oh noes, the nasty atheist are going to murder poor innocent god with bad words.

It is rather telling that religious people (Christians especially) are so concerned that their god can can be so easily dispatched with a couple of words, isn't it?

Atheist: God, you probably don't exist.

GOD: ...

Fundamentalists: ARRRRRGGGGH!!!! *gnashing of teeth* *protest* *boycott* *etc*

Other Comments by Don_Quix

11. Comment #270207 by Verylee on October 23, 2008 at 8:09 pm

Fox News was summarizing it as a plot to "kill God."

So much for god's omnipotence then!

Other Comments by Verylee

12. Comment #270208 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 8:12 pm

How about a NASCAR car with a Red A?

Genius! Although most people at NASCAR races would probably think it stood for some sort of new anti-impotence drug.

Other Comments by Don_Quix

13. Comment #270211 by alexmzk on October 23, 2008 at 8:25 pm

i hope this bus drives past a lot of churches on its route.

Other Comments by alexmzk

14. Comment #270213 by MPhil on October 23, 2008 at 8:29 pm

Perhaps a TV-ad mocking the perception of atheists by the fundie-nutjobs? You know, juxtaposing ominous music and narration with footage of atheists being ordinary, kind, intelligent, thoughtful people. Although that might probably be more apt in the US than in the UK.

Other Comments by MPhil

15. Comment #270214 by Fuller on October 23, 2008 at 8:33 pm

but while this is closer to what most atheists believe, "probably" is shorter and catchier, which is helpful for advertising. I also think the word is more lighthearted, and somehow makes the message more positive.

Nup. 'Almost certainly' is far better. It expresses the strength and confidence of atheism at the same time as emphasising its non-dogmatism (is there a word for that').

Aside from that though, I'm extremely happy about this campaign. 'Just the beginning', indeed.

Edit: Curse you, question mark demons!!!

Other Comments by Fuller

16. Comment #270216 by Verylee on October 23, 2008 at 8:38 pm

juxtaposing ominous music and narration...

It would go way over their heads!
I can see them now, nodding their collective heads sagely and saying "see! It doesn't matter how good you are, if you don't believe in (MY) god, you're still going to go to hell".

Other Comments by Verylee

17. Comment #270217 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 8:39 pm

Perhaps a TV-ad mocking the perception of atheists by the fundie-nutjobs? You know, juxtaposing ominous music and narration with footage of atheists being ordinary, kind, intelligent, thoughtful people. Although that might probably be more apt in the US than in the UK.

I don't know if Geico (the insurance company) runs the same ads in the UK as they run in the US, but I'd find it hilarious to see the Geico cavemen being skeptical of religion. Maybe instead of the cavemen being offended by Geico saying "it's so easy a caveman could do it", they could be offended by fundies constantly telling them they don't exist.

Other Comments by Don_Quix

18. Comment #270218 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 8:52 pm

It couldn't have happened without you

I'm all embarrassed now - it was nothing :-)

Lee

Other Comments by LeeC

19. Comment #270220 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:12 pm

Ideas' Well, 83,000 pounds does not go a long way in advertising and so the ‘shock’ tactic could be the way to go.

Just look how much free advertising the ‘shock’ that atheists would think about having signs with ‘probably does not exist’ on the buses...

Think about how much free advertising could be got with some ‘real’ shock tactics...

let’s quote the bible or Koran at them in the next ad campaign. (And I think the mere mention of the Koran would start the debate)

Any good bible verses...

How about this on the side of a bus

So what does Jesus say'
"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Matthew 10:34

I know the Christian will just say I cherry picked my quote out of context (And - they never do this right) - but it might start a debate on the news, radio, TV etc

Lee
UPDATE: Curse my like of question marks... Grr

Other Comments by LeeC

20. Comment #270221 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 9:15 pm

http://i35.tinypic.com/2ir11kg.jpg

Other Comments by Don_Quix

21. Comment #270223 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:18 pm

Hi Don Quix,

THAT was funny... I now want to see it on the side of a bus

Other Comments by LeeC

22. Comment #270224 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:19 pm

For a slogan you need a good soundbite, not a philosophy essay, I say drop adjectives like "probably" and "almost certainly". They are tedious.

But on second thought, who cares whether some abstract God exists or not?

Even if it does no one knows what he wants with us or if he wants anything with us anyway, all we've got is insane people in funny constumes claiming they know what God wants and they all tell different stories. For all intent and purpose we are living without God anyway.

The message should be that an honest person can only live as if there is no God, we can only be responsible for other humans, not some supreme being that in all likelihood is only a figment of the imagination of neurotic men (men cooked up most of the bullshit).

Here is my proposal:

"God is the pacifier for the stunted. Get over it and grow the fuck up!"

Bet styrer would like this.

Here is a good soundbite from Marx:

"God = "I don't know", but ignorance is not an argument."

Other Comments by Bonzai

23. Comment #270225 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 9:19 pm

Comment #270213 by MPhil on October 23, 2008 at 8:29 pm

We're only talking 100,000 or so. It's really fuck all, actually, in terms of a campaign.

TV's out, I think.

Nice to see you, by the way.

Best,
Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

24. Comment #270226 by Brian English on October 23, 2008 at 9:19 pm

But Lee, you know that Thor isn't real. Unlike cosmic jewish zombie.

Other Comments by Brian English

25. Comment #270229 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 9:20 pm

Don Quix -

It is rather telling that religious people (Christians especially) are so concerned that their god can can be so easily dispatched with a couple of words, isn't it'

I would say (Muslim especially):

Printed words on a Bus: "Allah, you probably don't exist."

Allah: "..."

Muslim Fundamentalists: "ARRRRRGGGGH!!!! Hate speech, hate speech, violated my beliefs, racist, islamophobic, censure, censure..."

*proceed to burn bus* *burn effirgy of bus* *burn embassy of bus* *burn X* *burn Y* *burn Z* *etc*

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

26. Comment #270230 by DanDare on October 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm

What about repeating the ad as a Google ad or something similar that links to an atheist page which itself links here and to Sam Harris etc?

Other Comments by DanDare

27. Comment #270231 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm

Comment #270224 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:19 pm

Strange, Bonzai. You don't read my posts - by your own admission - and have dismissed me in former times as simply a 'cranky guy with a colourful vocabulary'. Yet you continue to mention me to this day in your posts.

I don't know why.

Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

28. Comment #270232 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:26 pm

24. Comment #270226 by Brian English
But Lee, you know that Thor isn't real. Unlike cosmic jewish zombie.

True - but it made me laugh.

Maybe we should just quote the facts...

UPDATE: Stupid bloody typo - fixed now

Other Comments by LeeC

29. Comment #270233 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:30 pm

Styrer,

Cranky guys with a colourful vocabulary can be entertaining. You turn swearing into an art form, that I do appreciate. :)

Other Comments by Bonzai

30. Comment #270234 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:31 pm

25. Comment #270229 by GordonYKWong
Muslim Fundamentalists: "ARRRRRGGGGH!!!! Hate speech, hate speech, violated my beliefs, racist, islamophobic, censure, censure..."

*proceed to burn bus* *burn effirgy of bus* *burn embassy of bus* *burn X* *burn Y* *burn Z* *etc*

You forgot...
Muslim Fundamentalists: "...And Islam is a peaceful religion"

Other Comments by LeeC

31. Comment #270235 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 9:35 pm

Lee -

I knew I left something out, how silly of me.

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

32. Comment #270236 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 9:36 pm

Comment #270233 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:30 pm

I feel the fucking thunderous wrathful linguistic facility heading - yes, by the name of Diacanu - our way to take your assertion to suitably off-linguistic territory.

By the way - blow it out your ass, you cunt.

Best,
Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

33. Comment #270237 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:37 pm

Don Quix

I think they will tell you that quote of Jesus's is out of context, and probably they are right.

A very powerful rebuttal to Jesus' "many will seek but few will find God" theology is contained in the long rant of Doestovsky's Grand Inquisitor.

Other Comments by Bonzai

34. Comment #270238 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:44 pm

Hi Bonzai

33. Comment #270237 by Bonzai
I think they will tell you that quote of Jesus's is out of context, and probably they are right.

My point would be purely to piss them off with shock tactics in the hope of free ads on radio, TV and newspapers.

Maybe it isn't a good idea - we should show how nice and friendly all us atheist's are

32. Comment #270236 by Styrer
By the way - blow it out your ass, you cunt.

That could work - right on cue :-)

Lee

Other Comments by LeeC

35. Comment #270240 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 9:45 pm

A powerful argument - from da Hitch - and which I've noted to be correct is that gentle Jesus, meek and mild, is the first fucker in the so-called 'moral' New Testament to make the proposition of the dead suffering in an everlasting lake of fire.

Such is not mentioned in the Old Testament.

Not quite sure why this point is not granted more publicity, in simple and easy refutation of the idea that Jesus is the embodiment of right action and thought.

Best,
Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

36. Comment #270241 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 9:47 pm

35. Comment #270240 by Styrer
A powerful argument - from da Hitch - and which I've noted to be correct is that gentle Jesus, meek and mild is the first fucker in the so-called 'moral' New Testament to make the proposition of the dead suffering in an ever lasting lake of fire.

So the ad should say

"From the man who brought you Hell... here's Jesus"

Other Comments by LeeC

37. Comment #270242 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 9:52 pm

Hitch's Ad a-la AMEX:

Rape - 10 to 20
Murder - 20 to Life
Doubting Jesus was the Messiah - Relentless Eternity

WTF

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

38. Comment #270243 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:54 pm

Lee

My point would be purely to piss them off with shock tactics in the hope of free ads on radio, TV and newspapers.

How about

'14 But Jesus said, "Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of heaven." And He laid His hands on them and departed from there. Matt 19:14-15'

Then we depict news headlines of paedophile priests.

Oh dear, I think I have crossed the line of good taste.. :)

Other Comments by Bonzai

39. Comment #270244 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:58 pm

I like Gordon's #37.

Other Comments by Bonzai

40. Comment #270245 by Styrer- on October 23, 2008 at 9:59 pm

Comment #270243 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 9:54 pm

'Cross the line.' Nope. I had a good chuckle at that one.

Best,
Styrer

Other Comments by Styrer-

41. Comment #270246 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 10:05 pm

Bonzai -

thanks, though I think there are good causes to publicise certain more ludicrous verses of Holy Books.

It would let the theologian and clergymen back-pedalling and saying "taken out of context..."

but ultimately, it would ignite a public discourse on the matter.

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

42. Comment #270248 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 10:05 pm

Hi Bonzai,

Then we depict news headlines of paedophile priests.

Oh dear, I think I have crossed the line of good taste.. :)

I was thinking along the same lines...

Have a picture of a priest and the lines "Think of the children"

People can make of it what they will :-)

Other Comments by LeeC

43. Comment #270249 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 10:08 pm

41. Comment #270246 by GordonYKWong
I think there are good causes to publicise certain more ludicrous verses of Holy Books.

It would put the theologian and clergymen on the back pedalling and saying "taken out of context..."

but ultimately, it would truely ignite a public discourse on the matter.

Phew... not just me.

The trick is finding the silly quotes... well, for me anyway.

I am looking forward to the knowledge that could be shared by people on this site.

Lee

Other Comments by LeeC

44. Comment #270250 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 10:10 pm

37. Comment #270242 by GordonYKWong
Hitch's Ad a-la AMEX:

Rape - 10 to 20
Murder - 20 to Life
Doubting Jesus was the Messiah - Relentless Eternity

Priceless :-)

Lee

Other Comments by LeeC

45. Comment #270251 by GordonYKWong on October 23, 2008 at 10:21 pm

Lee -

Phew... not just me.

The trick is finding the silly quotes...

As a strategy it could backfire, I mean while we are publicising the one segment of Bible, the clergy will be publicising the whole Bible, it could play into their hands somehow.

But seriously, the bible is bullocky two inches thick. I think this strategy would work quite well.

I personally like this lump of steaming absurdity:

Duet
14:9 These ye shall eat of all that are in the waters: all that have fins and scales shall ye eat
14:10 And whatsoever hath not fins and scales ye may not eat; it is unclean unto you.

lucky I am a vegetarian then :-|

Other Comments by GordonYKWong

46. Comment #270252 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 10:32 pm

45. Comment #270251 by GordonYKWong
As a strategy it could backfire, I mean while we are publicising the one segment of Bible, the clergy will be publicising the whole Bible, it could play into their hands somehow.

Maybe - but it would be funny that the atheist is promoting the reading of the bible :-)

But seriously, the bible is bullocky two inches thick. I think this strategy would work quite well.

The idea should be road tested of course. I just think it would make a lot of noise and with only 90,000 pounds it is the best form of advertising.

Lee
PS
Is it time to go home yet... work is going really slow today

Other Comments by LeeC

47. Comment #270253 by ev-love on October 23, 2008 at 10:38 pm

A Jesus quote you could use:

How about Luke, 19: 27 ?

“But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.”

Other Comments by ev-love

48. Comment #270256 by LeeC on October 23, 2008 at 10:48 pm

“But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over them, bring hither, and slay them before me.”

Did Jesus really say that' It has to be a parable right

I like it though... I like it...

Jesus is a nice chap isn't he.

Didn't Jesus have something to say about burning people as well

Lee

Other Comments by LeeC

49. Comment #270257 by Bonzai on October 23, 2008 at 11:01 pm

So we are taking a cue from the U.S. election, aren't we ? Negative ads WORK! But only to a degree and it has to be intelligent, it backfires if we stoop to the McCain-Palin level of smear and stupidity.:)

Other Comments by Bonzai

50. Comment #270258 by Don_Quix on October 23, 2008 at 11:07 pm

Bonzai:
I wasn't quoting scripture. I was quoting a previous post so I could have an excuse to post the Thor inspirational link :)

Other Comments by Don_Quix

Reload Comments | Back to Top