1. Is religion a threat to rationality and science?

Comment #172985 by Ajuydog on April 30, 2008 at 8:16 am

Could this be the offending article on K-Ar dating of Mount St Helens rocks? Published in Creation Ex Nihilo Technical journal
comic. Serious peer review there!

http://www.answersingenesis.org/tj/v10/i3/argon.asp

If so talk origins has some responses.

*exit stage left*

2. Fleabytes

Comment #145798 by Ajuydog on March 18, 2008 at 6:41 am

Pathfinder

what is it about Free Will and mixed massages you fail to understand?

3. Dispatches: Holy Offensive

Comment #135479 by Ajuydog on February 29, 2008 at 2:47 am

JuxtaMonkey,

I have spent many happy hours walking round London and would be able to suggest an itenerary to take in quite few interesting things in a day or two so if you fancy getting on some comfotable shoes and walking all day I could send you a path. I might even have it on google maps (must check, though). One of the delights of walking is that it is free! and you see so much more than on a tour. Personally I like the many alley ways and hidden corners away from the crowds an the magnificent parks and (free) museums ...so much to see and do. So let me know
if you are interested.

"Sir, if you wish to have a just notion of the magnitude of this city, you must not be satisfied with seeing its great streets and squares, but must survey the innumerable little lanes and courts. It is not in the showy evolutions of buildings, but in the multiplicity of human habitations which are crowded together, that the wonderful immensity of London consists."
Samuel Johnson

and while we are quoting Johnson, this is for the benefit of David Robertson "Sir, I have found you an argument; but I am not obliged to find you an understanding."

4. Bill Maher on Larry King Live

Comment #125797 by Ajuydog on February 12, 2008 at 4:26 am

Hello everyone, I am a frequent lurker on this site and infrequent poster primarily because of the many well informed people on this site who argue so eloquently and express their thoughts much more clearly than I could hope to. I do however feel that I must interject to add my thoughts on the issues raised on this thread relating to Western medicine and apologise for the long post.

1. Lifestyles contributing to disease

It is quite correct to state that lifestyle makes important contributions to the burden of disease for example sedentary lifestyles in conjunction with poor diet lead to cardiovascular disease like stroke and heart disease. It is wrong, however, to imply that western medicine does not take this into account. We seek evidence about the causes of disease and try to address these. Exercise programmes are an essential component in cardiac rehabilitation after a heart attack and extensive advice is routinely given on lifestyle. It would be wrong to deny people pharmacological treatments which also reduce their risk of death in the future. If all people led a healthy life then we would undoubtedly have less disease, however, we are faced with people who already have diseases and it would be wrong not to treat these to the best of our ability according to the best evidence available. We cannot alter the past lifestyles of people, only their future ones. It is also well recognised that behaviour change is very hard to achieve, however much we stress its importance.

All medical students learn about the social determinants of disease and western medicine also teaches us the concept of health is a state of “total mental, physical and social wellbeing, not merely the absence of disease� (WHO definition). That western medicine seeks to treat symptoms only is a myth. We go to great lengths to try and reduce the future burden of disease by encouraging healthy lifestyles in schools (free fruit, improved school meals, more exercise time etc) and create lasting healthy habits. One of the problems is that poverty is a major contributor to ill health and is of course very hard to eradicate.

2. There are more diseases now

This is primarily a problem of ascertainment; that is we can test for disease better now than at any other time in history and find new diseases and variants we didn’t know about previously but that does not mean they were not there. Lifestyle disease become more prominent in old age and by the mere fact that we now live longer they become more prominent. If we all died in our 4th decade there would be practically no heart disease but that is hardly ideal.

We also do find new diseases such as HIV, SARS and variant CJD and also understand much more about familiar ones e.g. the animal origin of measles, smallpox, TB among others which arose through human settlement and the domestication of animals in the last 10000 years.

3. Indigenous people living relatively free of disease

I’m afraid this smacks of the noble savage idea and seems to assume that indigenous peoples lived a utopic pastoral life until the arrival of evil western colonists. It is true that many aboriginal peoples were decimated by disease like smallpox and measles but I would be prepared to bet that they had very high infant mortality and short, hard lives with more that their fair share of disease whether that be malaria in the tropics or Chagas disease in South America and TB (not introduced by the colonisers). Given the fact the Arawak Indians smoked tobacco, it is a safe bet that they had tobacco related disease too. Since this habit was adopted by the colonisers it might be true that the Arawaks have caused millions of deaths worldwide. (facetious, I know)

4. Limits of Western medicine

Western medicine does of course have its limits but we do our best to study disease and their causes and through science and research gather evidence on the best ways to address ill-health. Vaccinations however are one of our major tools to fight infectious disease and contribute significantly to the improvement in average life expectancy in the last 50 years. Clean water and improved living standards are probably the single most important factor in improving health.

Specific diseases certainly can be cured and are cured routinely. The fact that we cannot cure some or only ameliorate symptoms in others does not invalidate the whole of Western medicine.

I think that is enough for now as I don’t want to bore everyone to tears although more could be said about genetics amongst others.

5. This deadly religious resistance to vaccinations

Comment #96904 by Ajuydog on December 11, 2007 at 4:27 am

Epeeist, you got there before me on Brian Deer, dammit!

It is worth remembering that measles still kills about 600 000 children per year, down from 4 500 000 per year before vaccination.

A couple of points on vaccination. In order for an infection to spread, each new case must result in at least 1 new case in a population. If, on average, each case results in less than 1 new case, the disease will die out in that population. If measles results in 10 new cases for each case in a totally susceptible poplation (unvaccinated and no natural immunity) and the vaccine is 95% effective the we would have to vaccinate at least 95% of people for each case to give rise to less than 1 new case and so allow the disease to die out. I hope that is clear!

Lastly, vaccination is responsible for as much health gain as all other medical technologies put together.

6. GOD VS. SCIENCE: A Debate Between Natalie Angier and David Sloan Wilson

Comment #92191 by Ajuydog on November 30, 2007 at 3:03 am

Just to add my tuppence worth. The truth claims of religion and their cost/benefit ratios are two different things; the words "true" "false" and "beneficial" harmful" can occur in any combination. It is not irrational to deny the existence of gods and argue that there may well be benefits to (some) individuals groups or societies. We should not be guilty of the ecological fallacy.

I dont know whether the following will strike a chord but it did make me think a little differently about some of the bizarre churches I saw (some rather too cozy with those in power)when I worked in Central America and was struck by the incredible drunkenness among men. You could drive to villages on a sunday morning and see many many men lying in the gutter and on the pavements unconscious with drink. Now the point of this story is that one day a physician who was in no way religious said to me that he advises patients with alcohol problems to "become evangelicals" because they enforce abstinence from alcohol which is a major contributor to domestic violence and a financial drain on already poor families. Leaving aside all the usual criticisms of theses churches, I think that religious conviction combined with stong community (peer pressure!) can help some people to change behaviour for the better.

I find myself flabbergasted by the mindless drivel, "breathtaking inaninity" obvious falsehood of religion and feeling nothing but contempt these purveyors of lies while pussyfooting around doing my best not to rock the boat with individuals who seem to derive real comfort from their beliefs. I suppose what it boils down to is that the world is a complicated place, motives are always mixed and we need a little wisdom mixed with common humanity in discerning who to shoot down in flames and who to treat gently.

7. Pupil defends teacher in Muhammad teddy furore

Comment #91768 by Ajuydog on November 29, 2007 at 7:37 am

I see from the New York times that the school say she has been fired. It is so nice to see them supporting her so courageously!

Maybe the following makes some sense of the whole sorry affair.

"On Tuesday, the British ambassador to the United Nations asked the Security Council to address warrants against a Sudanese official and a militia leader accused of war crimes in Darfur, a troubled region of western Sudan where more than 200,000 people have died. Some Sudanese analysts wondered if charges had been filed against the teacher in retaliation." NYT

8. Mother dies after refusing blood

Comment #85579 by Ajuydog on November 6, 2007 at 8:44 am

Bloody hell Keith, isn't it a bit over the top to think this borders on the "mass sociogenic illness" that engulfed the country on the death of "saint" Diana. Maybe there is a little hand wringing but what grates is that we had the tools and expertise to hand to easily prevent a death and were unable to do so solely because of religious conviction. Most stupid deaths require rather more complex solutions (HIV and condoms?)and it is rare to be able to point out an individual who would not be helped because of religion. It does remind us how batshit crazy these beliefs are and how readily people act on them, but hell, we know that already and I must get back to work.

9. Mother dies after refusing blood

Comment #85514 by Ajuydog on November 6, 2007 at 3:40 am

Cold comfort indeed!

I wonder whether in these sorts of situations, a sort of "stockholm syndrome" arises (the parallels are not of course exact). Perhaps a resident psychologist could comment.

As to ideas changing with age, when I was at university and seriously questioning my faith, a church leader who dealt with students tellingly observed that many people change at this age (22ish)and "fall away from the Lord".

10. Mother dies after refusing blood

Comment #85502 by Ajuydog on November 6, 2007 at 3:09 am

I echo the feelings of horror and sadness expessed in this thread at a pointless waste of life and also concurr with Quetz that to treat someone aginst their wishes when they are of sound mind is assault. What I would like to add however is that it is hard enough for the faithful to give up belief and the years of emotional investment it entails, but to come to terms with your faith costing your wife and childrens mother must be almost insurmountable. I cant even begin to imagine how the husband would cope with the anger and loss should he lose his faith. It is perverse to think he may draw comfort in the religion that cost him so dearly.

11. Religion is not incompatible with Science: 'Non-Overlapping Magisteria'

Comment #81665 by Ajuydog on October 25, 2007 at 2:34 am

I do think that NOM is a valid concept but not in the sense that Gould meant it. It exists in the mind of the theist who accepts the validity of the scientific method. In order to avoid cognitive dissonance (tension that may result from having two conflicting thoughts at the same time, wikipedia) arising from the contradictory world views of science and theism; theism as revealed "truth" and science as a successful explanation of how the world works, a psychological strategy for resolving that tension is required. Hey presto! NOM which avoids implosion of deeply held convictions and in a "puff of logic" (apologies to Douglas Adams).

12. Teacher: I was fired, said Bible isn't literal

Comment #74083 by Ajuydog on September 27, 2007 at 7:17 am

Afternoon all, this is my first post after much interesting reading and far too much time not doing what I should be doing! Tut tut you lovely lot are leading me astray.

Has anyone considered the possibility that Northern Bright's

....elephant is a bonnie bird.
It flits from bough to bough.
It makes its nest in a rhubarb tree
And whistles like a cow

Not that I can prove it of course. Speaking of which,

'As I was walking up the stair,
I met a man who wasn't there.
He wasn't there again today.
I wish, I wish, he'd go away.

Sorry. Must stop but my sense of the ridiculous has been touched off…