Comments by Steve Zara

Comment #222222 by Steve Zara on July 31, 2008 at 2:03 am

Comment #222221 by Serdan

It's not a useful generalisation.

Just consider Catholics. They all, in principle, sign up to the business about the Pope being in charge and having a tendency to be infallible, and yet the number who use contraceptives (especially in Western democracies) is considerable.

It would make no sense to extrapolate from having contact with such Catholics to a statement that all Catholics use contraceptives.

That is my impression of what you are doing.

752. Breeding for God

Comment #222217 by Steve Zara on July 31, 2008 at 1:36 am

Comment #222215 by Serdan

Yes.

753. Breeding for God

Comment #222213 by Steve Zara on July 31, 2008 at 1:00 am

Comment #222209 by Serdan

I specifically referred to the muslims that I have personally interacted with.

You didn't when you made this statement:

Then I found myself in a position where I had the chance to actually interact with muslims and what I found was that the "moderate muslim" is an oxymoron.

That's quite a generalisation.

754. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222058 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 2:00 pm

Comment #222056 by decius

As a teenager I used to take holidays in Italy all the time. Never been to Croatia though.

755. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222054 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:53 pm

Comment #222051 by kkelly

Are you going to post anything that isn't reactive?

Do you have anything at all either amusing or useful or intelligent to contribute?

756. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222047 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:40 pm

On a serious note. If you want to clear that one up, there are specific DNA analyses for establishing with a degree of certainty the countries of origin of one's ancestry.

I rather like the mystery, although with great and great-great grandfathers called Giovanni and Giorgio, an Italian ancestry seems probable.

On my mothers side, I am, I think, some combination of Irish and Canadian.

757. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222038 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:16 pm

Comment #222029 by decius

I am Italian, but I have been living abroad, in many different countries, for the past 20 years.

I am probably of Italian ancestry. The uncertainty is that the town of Zara(Zadar) (thought to be the origin of the surname of my ancestors) has swapped between Italian and Austrian ownership.

758. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222031 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:09 pm

Comment #222025 by al-rawandi

I don't mind disagreeing with you about anything (and I have disagreed with you about a lot), because no matter how passionately you argue, you attempt to argue with evidence. You are one of a few on this site who have fundamentally changed my mind on a subject based on rational argument. Because of that, I have a lot of respect for you.

759. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222017 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 12:56 pm

Comment #222007 by al-rawandi

Please don't change. The site would not be the same without you in full-on mode.

760. To beat extremism we must dissolve religious groups

Comment #222001 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 12:30 pm

Comment #221965 by kkelly

I suggest you seriously consider what you are doing posting here. This is supposed to be a site for rational discussion. That discussion may get intense at times (a nod to al-rawandi and Falusi*), but I find your posts to have no rational content, and are often highly offensive. Unless you change your posting style, I will have a tendency to mark your posts offensive without hesitation.

(*) It is quite fun to watch people get angry yet still debate based on vast factual knowledge.

761. Breeding for God

Comment #221943 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 10:42 am

Comment #221941 by Ishruul

Too bad most people now have adopted the way showned to us by the Crab people, causing the mass to become apathetic wussies.

I see no evidence that the mass of people are wussies. Just consider the huge popularity in the UK of rags like the Daily Mail, whose views are far from PC.

762. Breeding for God

Comment #221935 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 10:26 am

Al-

Agreed. Muslims are a problem, but there should be a specific solution, not general anger.

Absolutely.

Fanusi-

But give me a break: when you see the clouds gathering all the time, can you blame me for seeing darkness ahead?

I do understand your concerns, but there is a real danger in exaggeration, even if unintentional

For one thing, people start to see a problem as insoluble. All through my life I have seen supposedly insoluble situations come to an end peacefully - the Cold War, the Irish situation, South Africa...

If you think you see clouds gathering, that is nothing compared with what the world faced in situations like the Cuban Missile Crisis, or the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan.

Your views and understanding of the nature of the problem are valuable (they have changed my views), but I think you need a bit of perspective - the UK will not vanish as a result of Islam. There may be conflicts between communities, but there will be some accommodation. We have to ensure that it goes in the direction of rationality, and not religious ghettos.

763. Breeding for God

Comment #221909 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 9:37 am

Fanusi wrote-

*gloomily* Ishrul better come quick, while there's still a UK left.

That is just incredibly silly. If anyone thinks that the UK, that fought so strongly against fascism in the last century, is going to allow itself to be taken over by any religious sect, they really don't have a clue, sorry.

764. Religions thrived to protect against disease

Comment #221698 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 2:35 am

Comment #221696 by Corylus

Dunno. Wouldn't this advantage be cancelled out by the health problems caused the inbreeding in isolated societies?

I am sure it would. Also, regular contact would be necessary to help keep groups "up-to-date" with the latest varieties of milder infections, such an influenza, otherwise one group could be wiped out by even a single contact with something that could otherwise have been easily dealt with.

765. Breeding for God

Comment #221693 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 2:25 am

Comment #221686 by Roland_F

It's not multi-culturalism to object to people who are born here being thrown out of the country. It is basic civilized behaviour.

If we want to deal with the problems of other cultures we have to deal with them in better ways than our ancestors did centuries ago.

It may just be my current mood, but I am getting tired of rants and suggested "solutions" that sound to me to be positively medieval.

I am not a multi-culturalist, but I am not willing to sacrifice my culture and its standards to deal with the problems of other cultures. If we turn into thugs to deal with those who threaten us we have already lost.

766. Breeding for God

Comment #221679 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:52 am

Comment #221667 by Old Sarum

I don't think people like Fanusi are xenophobes. I do think they go over the top sometimes though, and I see a danger in that. There is no doubt that there are many who use attacks against Islam as cover for racism. I find that unacceptable, and I think we have to be very careful that we don't empower such people.

I also dislike implications that muslims are somehow "immigrants" who can "go back". Most muslims in the UK were born here. They have every right to stay, and I had hoped that transportation of people we didn't like to foreign lands was a thing of the past.

I may be naive, but I consider most people to be reasonable and moderate, whatever they label themselves. I think part of what needs to be done is to ally with such people to try and change religions from within.

Yes, I know this sounds wishy-washy liberal stuff, but I see no other option that won't lead to disaster.

767. PZ Myers Desecrates a Eucharist

Comment #221659 by Steve Zara on July 30, 2008 at 1:09 am

How about a video ridiculing the foaming-at-the mouth Catholics?

768. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221291 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:36 pm

Al-

Wealth and power centers that reside with a few people is little different from such power residing with a strong central government. This is why libertarians disdain centralized power (whether centered in the government, or private centers of power).

This isn't true. People can vote out central democratic governments, but not the few who are rich. I have no problem with strong centralised government as long as it is accountable.

769. Faith is not the answer

Comment #221281 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:30 pm

Comment #221271 by Teratornis

Peak oil looks sure to reduce motorized travel, so we can expect obesity to decline in the modern countries.

Not really. People will sit at home and have pizzas delivered on nuclear-powered motorcycles.

770. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221243 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:04 pm

Al-

I do the work in the assistant portfolia management role (trading, rebalancing, settlements, broker relationships, etc...). This is my morning and is pretty routine. I also do product management which is incentive based, which means that I have target asset levels, and I receive bonuses for reaching those.

I understood many of those words, like "this", "morning" and product".

I am about to post an entry on my blog about topological magnetic monopoles. I feel somehow comforted in our mutual lack of comprehension.

771. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221232 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:54 pm

Comment #221227 by al-rawandi

Well said! That is my view of work too.

772. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221226 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:51 pm

Comment #221220 by thewhitepearl

I see nothing wrong with support for the needy being government mandated in a democratic system.

773. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221225 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:49 pm

Comment #221213 by thewhitepearl

You say:

11 year old? While they still live under the roofs of their parents? Unless the parent permits it, I disagree.

and now you say:

absolutley not.

You say:

How the parents want to educate them is their priority...It may not always be the right choice or something everyone agrees with.

Then you say:

But I am also dictating what parent's do with their children. Unless it violates basic human rights. And that's tough to swallow but, that's the truth. Which why I'm all about increasing public awareness in science and helping to rid of irrationality.

Which is contradictory. Who is to dictate and enforce what contradicts human rights but the state?

What I am, hopefully in a friendly way, pointing out is ... beware of posting simplistic statements. You may not be expressing what you really mean, and they can be mis-interpreted.

774. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221208 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:36 pm

Comment #221207 by al-rawandi

Re: Windows.

You have my sympathies!

TWP - perhaps you could respond to the question about 11-year olds getting married if their parents agree?

775. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221206 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:33 pm

Comment #221199 by thewhitepearl

I should be able to do it out of my free will. Not because it's forced. It's your life do what you want, don't expect me to pick up the slack.

I have here a list of 100,000 people who are less fortunate that you. Please rate them all, and post it back to me by next tuesday (we have to get the benefits cheques out, or some will starve).

I have a lot of respect for Al-rawandi, as although he makes statements I often disagree with, they do seem thought through (although I sometimes disagree with his language).

I don't get that impression here, although I am willing to be convinced otherwise.

776. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221202 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:24 pm

Comment #221193 by al-rawandi

That sort of sounds like social engineering. Hardly the government stepping back and letting people live their lives!

Also, Al, I think it is about time I introduced you to Linux. I run Ubuntu. It is about 4x faster than Windows on any given computer. Open Office handles all Excel files and Access databases, and Unix has been handling "flipping back and forth since about 1972, unlike Windows.

Try it sometime! It's fast and free.

777. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221188 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:17 pm

Comment #221183 by al-rawandi

Sound fair?

Now if you are trying hard and having troubles we can discuss this.

I entirely agree with you Al. I am just a bit puzzled by the idea of a system that "promotes" hard work.

778. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221185 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:14 pm

A 16 year old should have the right to get married? A 13 year old? 11 year old? While they still leave under the roofs of their parents? Unless the parent permits it, I disagree.

I am puzzled. You think a parent should allow an 11-year-old to get married?

Well I would qualify (education) as a basic human rights. How the parents want to educate them is their priority...It may not always be the right choice or something everyone agrees with.

I am pretty astonished by this. You mean a parent should be free to raise a child in an entirely faith-based environment, with no science education?

The freedom to be raised to make their own decisions as adults? Well once they are adults they should be able to make their decisions. I don't understand where you are coming from in that respect.

You seem to be saying that cults should be free to raise and indoctrinate children however they like.

779. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221172 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:03 pm

Comment #221167 by thewhitepearl

Sounds like any other system that promotes anything other than hard work, imagination, elbow grease, and the such would breed more spoiled brats.

This sounds a bit prescriptive. Why should we rely on a system to promote hard work? Shouldn't it be our choice?

780. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #221169 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 12:01 pm

Comment #221143 by thewhitepearl

Children don't have the right to get married like adults do. Unless of course a parent allows them to do so.

I am not sure I understand this. I think that children should have rights to marriage (if appropriate) independent of parents views.

Unless they are putting a child's life in danger (like if they were putting another humans life in danger) the state shouldn't be involved.

I have to disagree with you strongly there. Children should have the right to things like education, and the freedom to be raised to make their own decisions as independent adults.

781. Council ban on atheist websites

Comment #221142 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 11:31 am

Comment #221132 by Cartomancer

My dear fellow, Birmingham is not North. It is barely in the Midlands.

782. Council ban on atheist websites

Comment #221110 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 10:46 am

This is incredibly stupid, but I can't see this lasting. There is no way they will be allowed to block, for example, the website of that nice Richard Dawkins who appeared on Dr Who.

783. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #220956 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 8:22 am

That's only because you have defined "violent" as not including incarceration. Personally I think this is daft, but have it your way.

I am a bit puzzled by this continuing debate about "violence".

Locking someone up is not violence. It really isn't. Not by any standards.

It may be a political ploy to say "the state uses violence" because it locks people up, but to me this is just word games, sorry.

784. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220826 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 5:22 am

Comment #220823 by annabanana

The thing about this that makes me angry is the way the Catholic church is punishing those who are "innocent". A wife who is totally monogamous may suffer and die of disease because of the actions of her husband (oh, and the church doesn't allow divorce from such a husband either, so she is stuck with him).

785. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220816 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 5:07 am

Comment #220811 by Cartomancer

Unintentionally, you have made me feel all maternal...

786. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220808 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 5:00 am

Comment #220801 by Laurie Fraser

You don't need any computer skills. If you can post here, you can use a blog. Go to to www.blogger.com and you can set one up in seconds.

787. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220796 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 4:49 am

To spare Quetz' blushes in having to self-promote:

http://musingsofastrangemind.blogspot.com/

Marvellous, especially the posts on Christianity.

788. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220749 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:55 am

Comment #220740 by Quetzalcoatl

Quetz - those links at the bottom of your post don't work.

789. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220745 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:48 am

Comment #220743 by Dr Doctor

Maybe a little wine would help?

790. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220730 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:30 am

Comment #220728 by Brian English

GPF? General Prayer Fault?

Re: Blog. I have skimmed. I will need more coffee to fuel brain before I read in depth.

791. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220727 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:27 am

Comment #220725 by Brian English

From what I remember, either suffering from allergies, or looking out the window.

792. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220723 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:23 am

Comment #220720 by Brian English

So saints are like "virtual prayer carriers"? It doesn't matter whether or not they actually exist (they are undetectable anyway). They carry the force of the prayer?

793. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220717 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:16 am

Comment #220711 by Dr Doctor

One thing that puzzles me is what happened to the prayers to all those saints that the Catholic church later decides weren't actually saints? Is there a system of saint deputies?

794. VOICES OF SCIENCE: PZ Myers - Buy it now on DVD

Comment #220713 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:13 am

Comment #220706 by Sigmund

I am going to have to agree. I absolutely love PZ Myers' scientific posts, and from what I have seen he is a superb lecturer, but he is not one of the top biologists, and I am sure he would agree.

A far more appropriate title would have been:

"Four fascinating discussions between Richard Dawkins and some of today's top scientific communicators".

But, I have never heard of David Buss before, so perhaps the communicator bit is not that good either.

795. Catholics To Pope: Lift Birth Control Ban

Comment #220708 by Steve Zara on July 29, 2008 at 1:01 am

I see just a bit of a theological problem about all this. The Pope is supposed to have a direct line to God. So what is the point of writing to him? It is also considered that the ban on contraception was one of the infallible statements of popes.

Apart from the strangeness of people having to work out whether or not a Pope is saying something infallible (if you have to work it out, what is the point?), writing a letter to God's messenger to ask him to (presumably) change his mind seems a bit presumptuous.

796. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #220337 by Steve Zara on July 28, 2008 at 10:17 am

Comment #220334 by al-rawandi

I am honestly confused about what people consider socialist! Some seem to consider the UK socialist, some don't.

Can someone clear this up?

797. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #220328 by Steve Zara on July 28, 2008 at 10:10 am

Comment #220323 by denoir

While somewhat better than socialist systems (which self-destruct pretty fast anyway)

Flipping heck. I had better get out of the UK then. I never realised that the NHS would lead to the destruction of society.

798. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #220276 by Steve Zara on July 28, 2008 at 9:14 am

Comment #220269 by denoir

Socialism is about bringing everybody to a common zero until we all die of starvation.

Twit.

Irate? I need your help here: further evidence...

According to your ethical system, if you have more than the poorest, you are morally obliged to give away your possessions.

We both know what is needed here, but it is more your style.

799. Richard Dawkins on Al Jazeera English

Comment #220272 by Steve Zara on July 28, 2008 at 9:12 am

Comment #220227 by fides_et_ratio

As something eternal that precedes spacetime, God is not subject to the limits that some on here are trying to place on him. It's illogical to try and constrain him in any way.

This reads to me just an illogical random noise. Words put together without meaning.

You don't get away with just making stuff up. You don't get to define something beyond contraints unless you have evidence for that.

It's reasonable to assume there was a creator and unreasonable at this point to assume matter/energy was born in a void.

No. It isn't. There is a very good reason why not.

A creator without limits and with a mind is infinitely more complex than to assume the universe arose spontaneously.

You are welcome, as far as I am concerned, to just believe "God did it". What you can't do is mess around with reason and logic to try and show it. You can't. That has been understood by scientists and philosophers for centuries.

Believe what you like, but if you want to convince anyone else, you are going to need evidence, not words.

800. A third of Muslim students back killings

Comment #220252 by Steve Zara on July 28, 2008 at 8:56 am

Comment #220239 by Quetzalcoatl

I am glad it's not just me who is a bit disturbed by that cat.

Comment #220250 by al-rawandi

The idea of facing you in a hot-dog eating contest is frankly terrifying. In that picture it is like you are so hungry you can't want for your hand to overcome the force of gravity.