Comments by decius

Comment #251403 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 12:34 pm

Comment #251400 by GoatBoy36

It was earlier in this thread, so I didn't deem it necessary.

Comment #251392 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 12:26 pm

Comment #251385 by GoatBoy36

so that wasn't an ad hominem attack just now then ... no, no of course not.

Did you follow the discussion earlier?
If you did, you'd know that it isn't an ad hominem.

He didn't reason why we should suspend civil rights and engage in extra-judicial killing of "anyone in possession of class A drugs", he simply stated it on the basis of his perceived belonging to an "intellectual elite", that is apparently privy to some special knowledge as to who has the right to live.

753. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251380 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 12:12 pm

Comment #251367 by Sargeist

Sorry, but I feel like I dealt with your points and not with your insanity.
Your original statement revealed an incredibly superficial understanding of certain issues, which didn't prevent you from advocating the most appalling solutions, and that also had to be brought to you.

754. Interstellar Space Molecules That Help Form Basic Life Structures Identified

Comment #251364 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 11:58 am

A team of scientists led by researchers from the Instituto Astrofísica de Canarias (IAC) has succeeded in identifying naphthalene, one of the most complex molecules yet discovered in the interstellar medium. The detection of this molecule suggests that a large number of the key components in prebiotic terrestrial chemistry could have been present in the interstellar matter from which the Solar System was formed.

This will thus be featured in Conservapaedia and Answer in Genesis:

A team of scientists led by researchers from the Instituto Astrofísica de Canarias (IAC) has succeeded in identifying God's mothballs, one of the most complex proofs of Creation yet discovered in the interstellar medium. This detection suggests that a large number of diaphanous and cheap clothing items are stored in the heavens, ready to be distributed to the souls of the righteous after the Rapture.

755. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251196 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 7:32 am

Comment #251184 by Sargeist

Sure, but it came out in the right context and I thought I might as well point it out.

756. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251182 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 7:11 am

Comment #251181 by Bonzai

You mean scatological beliefs?

757. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251179 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 7:06 am

Comment #251173 by Fanusi Khiyal

Sargeist did, and that's why I was arguing about those groups and principles.

If you want to criticise those people, feel free.

Comment #251167 by Sargeist

I love Sam Harris

Good, he is an utilitarian himself (just like Beccaria), and his comments about torture were utilitarian, certainly not a blank cheque for torture.

758. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251171 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 6:53 am

Comment #251166 by Fanusi Khiyal

Criticising a group is one thing, repealing the concept of inviolability of one's home and advocating the extra-judicial killings of members of those groups is quite another.

759. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251169 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 6:49 am

Comment #251162 by Sargeist

what about just killing knife-wielding idiots? That ok?

They get killed when they brandish their weapons and threaten the safety of others. No one objects to drastic measures when required.
If you are advocating extra-judicial killings or the death penalty, I again invite you to read Beccaria's relevant chapters. It's for free.
The principles highlighted there made the transition in Europe from Medieval to modern justice.

Many reforms in the penal codes of the principal European nations can be traced to Beccaria's treatise, although few contemporaries were convinced by Beccaria's argument against the death penalty. When the Grand Duchy of Tuscany abolished the death penalty, as the first nation in the world to do so, it followed Beccaria's argument about the lack of utility of capital punishment, not about the state's lacking right to execute citizens.

760. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251164 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 6:41 am

Comment #251154 by Fanusi Khiyal

I spoke of recreational drug use.
Therefore "junkies" is a straw man.

With regard to Palin, her incompetence ignorance and eschatological beliefs do indeed disqualify her from the job. Harris makes a water-proof case, and no one critical of his article has been able to make a dent into it. Attacking Palin's opposition and showing them wrong or incompetent do not in any way make her more appealing.

761. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251153 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 6:28 am

Comment #251146 by Sargeist

I am sure that you are a sensible and clever individual in many ways. You probably just didn't think this one through and let the gut take over.
There is also an element of christian pseudo-morality and propaganda that feeds on those feelings, and has managed to permeate secular thought enough to distort the public perception of recreational drug use - which is really no different from drinking with moderation and often leads to great artistic intuitions.

You should really abstain from harsh condemnation until you have all facts in, that's all I'm saying.

762. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251142 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 6:03 am

Why, Titania, thank you.

Comment #251116 by Sargeist

Well, I'm sure lots of people have views that many others don't agree with.

This would imply that all views are equally meritorious. Those you have just stated are demonstrably wrong and morally reprehensible.

I don't know why my desire to have certain people removed from society doesn't make me an elitist and intellectual snob

That would be true if you actually were member of an intellectual elite, and if what you suggested would indeed benefit an elect circle of individuals. But you spoke like a brutal bigot with an overblown self-esteem, projecting a parochial in-group mentality - solely based on personal and uninformed prejudice - to an Orwellian idea of society where three centuries of progress had to be incinerated in order to appease your blood-thirsty ignorance.

I hear on the TV from time to time

I had no doubt whatsoever that you form your opinions in front of a TV set.

Now, I don't want to get into crime and we should deal with it, but I suggest that you read one of the Enlightenment pivotal works: Beccaria's Crime and Punishment.

However, I am ready to prove wrong your views on drug use and possession, and show how such activities do in fact greatly benefit part of the intellectual and artistic elite.

763. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251109 by decius on September 21, 2008 at 5:03 am

Comment #251105 by Sargeist

people's houses searched and anyone found in possession of class A drugs and/or weapons put up against a wall and blown away.

So... I am an elitist, and an intellectual snob,

Don't flatter yourself, it really is not the case.

764. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250842 by decius on September 20, 2008 at 3:29 pm

Comment #250841 by ggab7768

You're just jealous.

Exactly!

765. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250840 by decius on September 20, 2008 at 3:18 pm

Comment #250839 by ggab7768

Should we dance on our hands, instead?

766. Turkish edition of The Ancestor's Tale sells out within a day!

Comment #250833 by decius on September 20, 2008 at 2:57 pm

Comment #250830 by mordacious1

I agree that it's highly unlikely, but well within their policies of silencing critics and they have the economic power to do it.

There was an analogous case in Italy, a couple of years ago. All copies of a volume highly critical of Berlusconi were bought by a single entity the same day of publication, but only in airport book stores.

I can't recall which one it was, but I'll check it out.

767. Turkish edition of The Ancestor's Tale sells out within a day!

Comment #250828 by decius on September 20, 2008 at 2:37 pm

Comment #250826 by mordacious1

There were only 2000 copies to begin with. It isn't an outlandish hypothesis, if you consider how much money 'they' funnel into the free distribution of their crappy atlas.

768. Look Who's Irrational Now

Comment #250822 by decius on September 20, 2008 at 2:05 pm

Comment #250815 by Diacanu

Oh, my, is this you finally admitting that "Downunder", was one of your sock puppets?

No, he had an epiphany and is now a full-time Chupacabra hunter.

His socks became energised in the washing machine through accidental contact with his magic mormon underwear. While drying, they began talking with David Robertson's voice, promising him immense celestial rewards if he succeeded in tracking down the Chupacabra.

769. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249733 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 1:06 pm

Comment #249705 by al-rawandi

Yeah, but in my opinion, jokes are funnier when they contain some truth, not so much so when they seek to subvert facts.

I was born 5 KM away from this place, and that single epic event allowed that part of Italy to be liberated from the Austrian yoke and to be exposed to the unfiltered values of the Enlightenment on a vast scale. Huge progressive reforms were introduced, and the clergy was forced to relinquish much power.
Much later, when the French left, the ancient regime couldn't be reinstated, because the people had tasted modernity for the first time.

Threfore I say: Vive l'Empereur. :)

770. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249703 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 12:41 pm

Comment #249690 by al-rawandi

Yeah, more hysteria. :)

771. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249692 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 12:35 pm

Comment #249688 by Fanusi Khiyal

That's weird, actually, considered the role that France played during the war of Independence. When do you reckon it did start?

772. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249687 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 12:29 pm

Correct me if I am wrong.
There was no animus between the US and France prior to the French refusal to join the Coalition of the Willies, right?

Then a whole 300 million people started to dance at the bashing tune orchestrated by Bush and his cronies, and to repeat the same tired jokes ad nauseam for almost a decade now.
How hysterical and sheep-like is that?

BTW, has no one across the Pond heard of Napoleon?

773. The President's Guide to Science

Comment #249676 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 12:17 pm

Comment #249637 by geehigh

I agree. It's also in very bad taste to seek publicity among those whom he criticises in the first place.
A typical christian hypocrite.

774. Eoin Colfer to write sixth Hitchhiker's Guide book

Comment #249666 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 12:09 pm

Comment #249655 by Darwin's badger

I just hope that Colfer's contribution is of a higher standard that Claude Voilier's "Famous Five" books.

I can't recall a single case in the history of literature when this type of operation hasn't failed miserably.
The driving factor behind is always economical, and to credibly replicate another author's brilliance and style for more than a few pages is nearly impossible.

775. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249646 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 11:48 am

Comment #249634 by thewhitepearl

Hi TWP,

have you fully recovered yet?

776. Sharia courts operating in Britain

Comment #249633 by decius on September 18, 2008 at 11:36 am

Hey, what's wrong with working little, drinking, smoking and having sex?

Has this site been bought by the mormons?

777. Royal Society's Michael Reiss resigns over creationism row

Comment #249211 by decius on September 17, 2008 at 5:53 pm

Comment #249195 by Jesus86

As for suggesting that "science is based on faith," you could not be further from the truth. I never made such a claim, nor implied, suggested, or even hinted at it. Ever.

You, sir, are a liar.

At one time, atheists used to be called "free thinkers." Sadly, no longer. They are becoming the most arrogant of social engineers in society. Sorry, but I choose not to be any more subservient to your pseudo-"scientific" moral views than to religious moral views. Get it?

The reference to AGW was to suggest that you apply your own stringent definitions and criteria to the claims if the IPCC and see if you would be left with a "scientific theory." I think you would have to concede that by your own standards, AGW isn't even a discredited theory; it isn't a scientific theory at all. If you want to be "rigorous," then be equally rigorous with your own cherished articles of faith.

IF we discovered something that was truly too irreducibly complex to be explained as a product of evolution by natural selection, then we would be in a quandary. To reverse the usual Dawkinsian / scientific mantra: However improbable an Intelligent Designer might be, it would be more probable than a theory that has been refuted by the evidence.

Plus a few dozen posts of apologetics for ID.

In other words, science is to you what fits your preconceived conclusions, and not what the scientists say it is. Everything else must be mantra or faith.

It is abundantly clear that you are a plant and a troll.

778. Evolution fine but no apology to Darwin: Vatican

Comment #249199 by decius on September 17, 2008 at 5:25 pm

Well you see, God is very mysterious

As a matter of fact, the mere discussion of his exceedingly high imperscrutability may lead to utter floccinaucinihilipilification.

779. Royal Society's Michael Reiss resigns over creationism row

Comment #249185 by decius on September 17, 2008 at 4:44 pm

Comment #249180 by Jesus86

The literalist twits who pounced on my ironic and metaphorical turn of phrase

Yeah, right. Your literary ingenuity flies right above our heads. As if, by now, we were not used to recognise your continuous snide comments hinting that science is based on faith and that we are believers of some sort. Just like you did three or four times in this last moronic comment of yours, too.

BTW, how do you manage to store all your straw men? They seem to outnumber the Terracotta Army of Qin Shi.

780. Royal Society's Michael Reiss resigns over creationism row

Comment #249023 by decius on September 17, 2008 at 12:29 pm

Comment #248995 by Jesus86

After I converted to the Big Bang theory as an undergraduate

It's a process called 'learning', you sanctimonious jackass.

It reveals a lack of perspective

Oh, the irony.

781. Royal Society's Michael Reiss resigns over creationism row

Comment #248906 by decius on September 17, 2008 at 6:16 am

I hereby issue a call to arms binding my fellow Dawkinsians to visit Wilkins's blog and set the esteemed doctor straight.

Brian English is doing an excellent job in countering Wilkins's nonsense and believer-friendly contortions, but I feel that a more robust intervention is needed to send the message across.

Foul-mouthed retorts welcome. :)

782. Letter from Sir Richard Roberts asking Reiss to step down

Comment #248418 by decius on September 16, 2008 at 7:31 am

Comment #248386 by scottishgeologist

By closing that board you guys have just blown an opportunity to properly engage in the debate of the Age. And it could be claimed that you look like you are running scared of getting "pwned"

Wow, I didn't know that.
Fuck him. He has the guts to come here hectoring us about "intolerance". Utterly incredible.

783. Letter from Sir Richard Roberts asking Reiss to step down

Comment #248413 by decius on September 16, 2008 at 7:14 am

Robertson

You dishonest trolling cunt endowed with a homoeopathic brain.

No one demanded the resignation of your accomplice in deception of the masses, until he made his views public. Such ideas are incompatible both with science and with the position that he holds.

The slant and spin of his ludicrous partial retraction do not in any way alleviate the gravity of his original statement.

Now, take your fuckwittery where it belongs: the pulpit or any other podium for dishonest demagoguery.

784. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247582 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 3:32 pm

Comment #247568 by Fanusi Khiyal

The left is tainted by ideas of unbridled multiculturalism and they are betraying their own early commitments to universal human rights.
Being a leftist, I have been arguing against this for ages, and I am very disappointed with the failure of left-wing intellectuals to stand up for the values of the Enlightenment.

I still think that by applying the existing laws without favouring any group on the basis of ethnic and religious sensibility, we would easily eradicate the Islamic threat.

Your solutions are far too radical, and it is not difficult to see why they can offend. Conservative and progressive forces should share a respect for the basic democratic rules and principles - what you suggest consists in their effective suspension. You should not be surprised that people react vehemently.

785. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247569 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 3:18 pm

Comment #247566 by GoatBoy36

I was aware of that part. I read the Blank Slate and I agreed with Pinker.

786. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247564 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 3:13 pm

Comment #247548 by Fanusi Khiyal

Thank you.

Your conclusions are still a non sequitur, though.

787. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247546 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 2:56 pm

Fanusi

I have changed my mind. :)

I found this article by Pinker, and he makes a very convincing argument (contrary to you I must say ), but he totally agrees with your views of primitive societies.

I think it's just fair for me to admit that you are probably right on that part of your reasoning.

788. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247510 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 2:00 pm

Comment #247501 by Fanusi Khiyal

Could you be more precise?

I don't mean to pester, I am genuinely curious.

Keeley and Leblanc first names are...

I found Nicholas Wade, who is a journalist, and I don't really care for non-scholars.

As for Andy's lecture, he said quite different things for what I can remember, but I will watch it again in case I missed something.

789. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247489 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 1:35 pm

Comment #247464 by Fanusi Khiyal

I will provide you with the chronology of peace for all the aforesaid states.
This is an easy one, even my dog has heard of it.

Pax Romana (Latin for "Roman peace") was the long period of relative peace and minimal expansion by military force experienced by the Roman Empire in the first and second centuries AD. Since it was established by the Emperor Augustus it is sometimes called Pax Augustea. Its timing was approximately from 27 BC to 180 AD.

There are other decades and centuries when the conflicts were limited to the external borders of the empire, and the whole Italian territory wasn't interested by war or rebellion.

As for my alleged dishonesty: we are talking about the ancient world, for Dawkins' sake. The ruthlessness was proportionate to the age and not remotely comparable to what came before and after.

BTW, could you indicate us any historian or scientist who bought into the Hobbesian myth of the State of Nature?

790. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247392 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 11:22 am

Comment #247373 by Fanusi Khiyal

Well, if you think the defining characteristic of greco-roman civilisation was brutality, then you probably wear some sort of mental blinders.

Of course you need an army to defend yourself (or even conquer as it was the case back then), but not because of the reasons that you and Hobbes imagine, and that's what we arguing here. Not whether war exists, but why it exists.

BTW, Rome, Athens and Venice all enjoyed entire centuries at peace, and the only mass crucifixion perpetrated by Rome was against the slave rebels lead by Spartacus, after he destroyed three legions and refused to surrender multiple times.

791. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247365 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 10:55 am

Comment #247359 by Fanusi Khiyal

I'd love to see how you fit General Butt Naked into your picture.

It fits like Sparta at the time of Athens, the Vandals at the time of the Romans, the Mongols at the time of the Venetian republic, and so on.

You try to draw general lines out of localised belligerent cultures.

792. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247357 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 10:43 am

Comment #247353 by Fanusi Khiyal

Then why do scientists speak of hunter-gatherers, rather than of brutish-warriors?

793. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247351 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 10:36 am

Comment #247337 by Fanusi Khiyal

And what then is the state of man in pre-history? Well, by your own statement they'll have been smaller and more disorganized, yes?
In other words in a state of tribal war. Continual, bloody, murderous war.

Prehistory is the Mesolithic (at the end of the Pleistocene), we have already seen that warfare wasn't the defining characteristic.
Peering back at the Palaeolithic is nearly impossible, and it's meaningless to think of Homo abilis as if it were our same species.

You have to consider that it's impossible to organise vast community without proper communications. That means at the very least horse domestication, beside agriculture that allows for storage of supplies and, by extension, development of a truly sophisticated culture out of the time spared from the constant search for food.
What you have to look at is the trend. If things were really Hobbesian, then the trend toward greater organisation would have been impossible.

794. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247335 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 10:17 am

Comment #247327 by Fanusi Khiyal

It's between those tribes that things get Hobbesian and nasty.

Actually, it's completely the opposite. While rivalries for stretched resources are bound to emerge, throughout history we see communities getting larger and larger and more widely organised.

795. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247322 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 10:08 am

Comment #247308 by Fanusi Khiyal

I don't deny that warfare has always been with us. The sophistication or brutality thereby involved reflect the technological level of specific groups, and is not defined by innate savagery. It is true that certain cultures are more belligerent, but that's a cultural construct (e.g. Sparta).
The modern view, though, is that - even in our remote past as hunter-gatherers in the Pleistocene - cooperation culture and social structures (regardless how embryonic) have been our defining characteristics. This is as remote as it can get from the naive depictions of Hobbes.

796. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247309 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 9:53 am

Comment #247305 by GoatBoy36

Never heard of him, I think.

Interesting story and article, thanks for sharing.

797. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247299 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 9:28 am

Comment #247290 by GoatBoy36

Again, for the third and final time: It's a device used by different writers to try to IMAGINE what it would be like with an absence of any political system.

Not in Hobbes case, and that's how we got to that. He uses it as a factual premise and so does Fanusi.

And finally: you try to lay evolutionary psychology on me, as if I hadn't JUST ARGUED that one could use works like the selfish gene and the moral animal to argue against the Hobbesian notion that a state of nature would be a war of every man against every man.

We agree on that, certainly.

One more thing: Islam, and your wondering whether you need to discuss it. Remember 9/11, 7/7, Madrid, Bali, etc.? Funnily enough, in your FICTIONAL touchy-feely multiculturalist paradise that you IMAGINE to be ordered by "progressive" ideas, the resurgence of Islam and the horrific acts committed in its name does seem oh ... kind of relevant.

Before you continue to erect straw men, let me disabuse you of the notion that I in any way support Islam, multiculturalism , or that I am in favour of a soft approach to these problems.

798. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247297 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 9:19 am

Comment #247289 by Fanusi Khiyal

But that's absurd. While it's true that the Greeks are credited with having originated much of our culture, by no means people before them lived in a state of primitive brutality.

What about the Sumerians, the Egyptians, the Phoenicians?. Eck, what about the people living in the Franchthi Cave in 9000 BCE in Greece (that's 8000 years before the Greeks), who had managed to import from Asia and cultivate almonds, pistachios and lentils?

Culture, commerce, navigation, even government (the crucial distinction that Hobbes makes) that existed for millennia in the same areas.

How can you brush off all this as uncivilised?

799. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247288 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 8:57 am

Comment #247285 by GoatBoy36

I could likewise explain to you what Arcadia and the Noble Savage mean in the context of political philosophy and how they influenced thinkers like Rousseau.
That would be all very interesting, but we could not use it as a meaningful concept to base a modern working political framework on it, because it's FICTION.

The last blow to the Noble Savage theory was delivered by evolutionary psychology, the same discipline that is destroying other similar falsehoods such as, guess what... the State of Nature.

800. Palin: average isn't good enough

Comment #247284 by decius on September 14, 2008 at 8:48 am

Comment #247283 by Fanusi Khiyal

Western civilisation will do, so we will have the transition clearly defined by a date or a century or an event.