51. Muslims outraged at police advert featuring cute puppy sitting in policeman's hat

Comment #203137 by black wolf on July 2, 2008 at 11:57 am

Ok, many of us got a false impression. Until anything further ensues, I retract my statement above. It was apparently unwarranted.
I still find it curious that some apparently unverified complaints prompt a public statement to appease potential protests. I think it's already too much that a 'diversity advisor' would theoretically advise to replace such a completely harmless image. Diversity - ur doing it rong.

52. Evangelical Christians sign up to a 'Church within a Church'

Comment #203090 by black wolf on July 2, 2008 at 11:10 am

Ah yes, faith, the great unifier of humanity. Just keep splitting up, I say. How about a lobster schism next?

53. Muslims outraged at police advert featuring cute puppy sitting in policeman's hat

Comment #203076 by black wolf on July 2, 2008 at 10:58 am

What?
A minority feels offended. Nobody is infringing on their civil rights or their religious freedom. Nobody forces them to display the ads.
As many here and elsewhere have been saying for months and years, this particular minority is actively seeking out stuff to feel butthurt about. Keeping dogs has been a part of human culture for a time one hundred times longer than their holy book has been around. Dogs have probably saved more lives and made more people happy than Islam ever has. They are an integrated part of Western culture and of many others worldwide.
And the 'force' (one should be calling them the 'wimps' from now on) effing APOLOGIZE for showing a PICTURE of a dog. APOLOGIZE!?!
Within a few years or less, the wimps will be forcing people to keep their dogs indoors because walking them outside might cause some medieval-brained muslim to feel offended. I'm serious. It will happen.
Why not stick a crescent moon and a sword to the Union Jack while you're at it.

54. Can't Darwin and God get along?

Comment #202392 by black wolf on July 1, 2008 at 12:27 pm

I've read a very detailed paper about the evolution of the blood clotting system about a year ago. There are fewer gaps than Giberson may think. I understand that he can't keep up with every detail of evolutionary biology, but then he shouldn't be making such unwarranted claims.
It amuses me that he rejects the gap-god, but has compartmentalized his faith so utterly that he isn't aware of his own cognitive dissonance when he puts a wild guess handed down and adapted from the stone age on equal footing with a scientific extrapolation of factual data. Mr. Giberson, the universe does not owe us explanations, meaning or comfort - we have to find these for ourselves. Just because we don't like to die, it doesn't mean there must be a God who prevents it. Once you can prove we have a soul which survives physical death, you might have a case. Your theological colleagues have attempted that for centuries, even with modern scientific means, and failed completely. There is less evidence for a soul than even for much of the most 'esoteric' physics. The dusty God idea has less to stand on than string theory, antimatter, or bubbling multiverses. Just let it go, it makes no sense.

55. CFI-UN Hamid Karzai Letter

Comment #202025 by black wolf on June 30, 2008 at 3:57 pm

As negative as many of the methods and effects of an authocracy may be, it may be the best preliminary solution for some countries, e.g. the Turkish model. The problems start when democracy gets constitutionally implemented without a large majority of the population backing it and privileges of anti-democratic ideologues and tribalists are preserved for a superficial stability. Has any political scientist worked out how to find the best 'point in time' when a country is ripe for a true democracy, or how to best get to that point? The dilemma is, the longer democracy is enforced through not-really-democratic means, the more the opposition consolidates their efforts and drifts towards militancy - which in turn increases the crackdown from the government, and on and on. Pakistan is trying to support faith schools and encourage gradual developments to moderacy within them, but that directly increases the fundamentalists' radicalism.

56. Jesus and Mo on Militant Atheists

Comment #202019 by black wolf on June 30, 2008 at 3:45 pm

My favorite web-cartoon site. I check almost every day to see if they have a new one, and they're almost always spot on. It's as if the writer(s) check this site's discussions constantly and use them for material. If you're watching, jesus-and-mo-guys, thank you for your outstanding work!

57. Your Brain Lies to You

Comment #201092 by black wolf on June 29, 2008 at 2:27 am

FALSE beliefs are everywhere. Eighteen percent of Americans think the sun revolves around the earth, one poll has found.

Most likely they don't believe that but just got confused by the question.

58. Psychiatrists: Least Religious But Most Interested In Patients' Religion

Comment #200579 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 11:43 pm

Last December, a German woman killed her five children because she thought a demon was telling her it would harass her and them. She decided to take the children away from the demon by taking them to the afterlife along with herself. Her suicide attempt failed, she voluntarily went to get psychiatric aid and is currently in court, charged with manslaughter. She has been diagnosed with paranoid schizophrenia.
The irony is that the family's local church held a memorial service - the same church that doesn't like to admit it teaches that demons are real. This sounds insensitive from me, and we don't know if it was religious teaching that inspired her delusion, or if she got the religious delusions after her mentality started breaking down. But I still think these tenets are the elephant in the room.

59. Common New Atheist Fallacies

Comment #200576 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 11:31 pm

quik,
really? Wow. I'm interested, when you were a believer, how would you have responded to the standard theist counter "That's just silly, the FSM doesn't offer any hope of salvation or an afterlife, and it's also just made up, unlike our religion which is divinely revealed and inspired". And how do you respond to that now?
Have you posted on this site's 'Convert's Corner'?

60. I believe that there is no God.

Comment #200570 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 11:09 pm

TeraBrat,
you kept a male baboon in a petting zoo? I don't know how to ask this, but do you like children? ;)

61. Psychiatrists: Least Religious But Most Interested In Patients' Religion

Comment #200568 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 11:05 pm

Dr.: "What does God tell you when you speak with him?"
Patient: "You don't exist, so why would I tell you?"

How is that one?

62. Common New Atheist Fallacies

Comment #200566 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 10:49 pm

"Regard […] to occasions, control and restraint of our actual raillery, and economy in bon-mots, will distinguish an orator from a buffoon, as also will the fact that we people speak with good reason, not just to be thought funny, but to gain some benefit, while those others are jesting from morning to night, and without any reason at all." (De oratore: II, lx. 247) - Cicero, 55 BCE
"You may perplex reason by subtlety, or overrule it by imagination. [---] Reason is disturbed by sophism, by imagination and by passion." (1927, 28) - W. G. Hamilton, 1808

I've taken these quotes from:
"Problematics of Using Rhetorical Irony in Parliamentary Politics" by Taru Haapala, available at http://www.ruc.dk/komm/Ansatte/vip/kimsc/papers/Paper_TaruHaapala.doc/

To which I would add: Sophism is disturbed by sarcasm, reason and facts.

63. Common New Atheist Fallacies

Comment #200563 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 10:32 pm

Oh boy, he's gonna explain critical thinking. Ok, jokes, sarcasm and ad hominems aren't reasonable arguments, I agree. And here's the first mistake, as I expected right in his first argument: Christopher Hitchens knows very well that sarcasm is not an argument, and he never pretends it is. Thanks for the strawman, Greg. You've demonstrated the first fallacy without telling your audience it is one. That's called lying. On to part 2.
Apparently Greg tries to set up his audience to believe atheists have only fallacies or divertive arguments to offer. Oh, will they be caught on the wrong foot when attempting to debate an atheist older than 12. Hitchens presents an argument in this sample clip - and Greg obviously cuts it off right in the middle. No, we don't want this defenseless audience exposed to a real argument, would we Greg? And then Greg completely misses the point. Yes Greg, if your culture and psychology explains why you believe in God, and various sciences explain how the idea of God and religion developed, it doesn't tell us anything about God. Why does that amaze you? As the sciences you just chose to ignore well explained that your God is a man-made idea, there is absolutely no point in learning more about that God. He's in your mind, and we know a lot about why he's there and not real. It's not a fallacy, it's a reasonable, logical and plausible explanation, i.e. a real argument. It's not the atheist's fault that you can't understand this, and it's not a fallacy. On to part 3.
Oooh, be careful there Greg, you really don't want to tell your flock a good argument against the existence of God. I don't know who your audience is here, but do you really have to take minute after minute explaining what an argument is? Then again, looking at the visitors we sometimes get here on this site, you probably do. While you're at it, you might want to exlain what a sentence is and why spelling is important for your credibility in a written discussion. But I digress, and this wasn't an argument. Here comes the argument, can't wait. Hitchens interrupted your friend? Too bad. You just spent almost four minutes saying absolutely nothing. But you're getting paid for this, right? On to the last part.
Oh Greg, you're lying again. Assuming that science can tell us something about reality is not circular reasoning. You better leave your glasses on the lectern when you leave and wait for a miracle to improve your eyesight. Or do you want to lose your credibility by relying on science like that? The circular argument is assuming that God exists and therefore the resurrection is evidence for God's existence, which is the fallacy Hitchens pointed out, and which you didn't tell your audience about. Way to deceive. Go ahead. You pick TGD now, this will be interesting. Ah, there it is. You simply chose to omit part 4 of Dawkins' argument completely, implying to your audience that the parts you skipped over were meaningless. It states: "The most ingenious and powerful crane so far discovered is Darwinian evolution by natural selection. Darwin and his successors have shown how living creatures, with their spectacular statistical improbability and appearance of design, have evolved by slow, gradual degrees from simple beginnings. We can now safely say that the illusion of design in living creatures is just that - an illusion."
This little video series ends here, but I think I've seen enough. Lying by omission is still lying, Greg. And exploiting an audience which apparently needs to be educated about the basics of critical thinking - chanting "NOOO" in unison on your cue as if they were kindergarten kids - by deceiving them in such a way by not actually presenting a single fallacy like you promised, is despicable.
Come visit this site and discuss some issues if you think you're so versed in spotting and avoiding fallacies. You'll not find a gullible, ignorant audience here, I promise.

64. A secular world is a sane world

Comment #200553 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 9:45 pm

I'd wager we'll need neurological treatment before we out-evolve religion. Especially as most religions preach reproduction with a very high priority on their lists of what their brain-person wants, right next to bringing the little children to them. As they believe that there's a soul that corresponds to a deity independently of the brain, and perfectly able to outlive the body, they would surely have no problem at all to swallow that little pill, right? It would just prove that the soul exists and doesn't change (with all our morality, conscience and character contained within), logically being no matter what we do with our brains after all, right?

65. Non-voters: It's all in God's hands

Comment #200344 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 11:00 am

Robert Mugabe claims that God wants him to rule. So, he forces the people at gunpoint to go to the election and vote for him. Guess who his role model is?

66. Stop distorting young minds!

Comment #200137 by black wolf on June 27, 2008 at 1:16 am

Oystein,
how does the Norwegian public respond to that? Are they graciously ignoring 'just another nutty person from the genetically special nobility'? I mean, that would be ok if she wasn't abusing misfiring brain functions of defensless people, right? Does someone stand up and rightfully call what she's doing the same thing Mengele did with his physical experiments? The children aren't dying right away, but if she thinks it's ok to set them on a path of cultism, some of them will suffer and have a greatly increased chance of actually dying in a cave, waiting for the end of the world, or in bed hoping for an angel to heal their perfectly treatable bladder infection.

67. Stop distorting young minds!

Comment #200044 by black wolf on June 26, 2008 at 5:08 pm

Let's assume even that all anousic schools were significantly better in all areas of education. What will we get out of that?
In the end, we'll possibly have hundreds, thousands of excellently educated people in very high positions, with just that one anousic area of their brain functions compartmentalized - and that little area tells them to push the red button to make Jesus come back (or the Hidden Imam etc.)
CREEPY!
Maybe I'm too pessimistic, but I can almost hear the argument: 'No, we can't scrutinize and control the curriculum they teach - we're out of tax money to finance all that .

68. The Latest Wedge Document

Comment #200035 by black wolf on June 26, 2008 at 4:49 pm

Everytime I open this site, I wish I would see a headline 'Creationists Unite, Independent Nation-State Granted'. Sadly in the real world they keep trying to take over the states that already exist, irreversibly damaging the minds of thousands of intellectually unarmed kids and thereby reinforcing their kooky ranks. And I also know that my imaginary headline means that we'd have another country in which people would get and put into practice ideas about converting other countries to their moronity through any method, from UN blackmailing to terrorism.

69. Band T-shirt draws charge

Comment #199482 by black wolf on June 25, 2008 at 8:20 pm

I hung out with C.O.F. backstage when they did their first Germany tour, at the Berlin gig. You know what they do? They relax, drink something and smoke a cigarette (Dani smoked one of mine, yayproud ;) ).
Now what do you think the televangelists do after their shows? I bet most of us would not find it very pleasant to watch...

70. Saudi Marriage Officiant : 'It Is Allowed To Marry A Girl At The Age Of One'.

Comment #198791 by black wolf on June 24, 2008 at 1:38 pm

Besides being immoral from our ethical standpoint, let's never forget that child marriage also greatly increases obstetric fistulae, prematurity, childbirth mortality, sexually transmitted diseases, including cervical cancer, and malaria. (wiki)

Jiten,
not exactly. Wikipedia gives a number of 39% for parts of Mali for instance (which has 90% muslims) married below age 15. I suspect most countries where the practice is relatively common would be reluctant to publish such figures, especially for prepubescent children, since they know very well how 'controversial' this topic is - or common and divinely sanctioned so that nobody even thinks of polling. As other posters have said, as an outsider you'll be told to shut up and not mention it before getting honest answers or open criticism from within those countries.

edit: I wonder how far Tony Blair's foundation will get in fighting malaria when he's told to shut up about some of the problems and causes.

71. Saudi Marriage Officiant : 'It Is Allowed To Marry A Girl At The Age Of One'.

Comment #198728 by black wolf on June 24, 2008 at 12:01 pm

Wasn't it also Saudi Arabia where men can marry for one night to circumvent the ban on prostitution? So theoretically they could easily have child brothels without any legal problems. How about we deport all our pedophiles to SA. It's a win-win (except for Saudi girls of course, but they're supposed to shut up anyway).
Anyone else feel like no level of cynicism can top the barbarity of that culture?

72. Saudi Marriage Officiant : 'It Is Allowed To Marry A Girl At The Age Of One'.

Comment #198723 by black wolf on June 24, 2008 at 11:57 am

We evidently need more (government subsidized) faith schools, so that the kids, especially the girls, can learn about their precious traditions as early as possible. Our morals will decay if we won't endorse pedophilia, and without it we will find no meaning in life.

73. Should We Rid The Mind of God? A Debate

Comment #198530 by black wolf on June 24, 2008 at 8:08 am

McGrath: 'please don't take the meaning out of my life'
Q: Well professor, what then is that meaning?
McGrath: 'it's very big and valuable and sentimentally pleasing...'
Q: What is it?
McGrath: 'there are a lot of books about it...'
Q: What is their conclusion, and why do you agree with them?
McGrath: 'it's very big and valuable and sentimentally pleasing...'

AAAARRRGHHHH!

74. On this Day: Galileo Sentenced for Believing Sun Is Center of Universe

Comment #198231 by black wolf on June 23, 2008 at 12:03 pm

LaurieB,
"After Galileo's death in Arcetri in 1642, his remains were deposited in a small room adjoining the chapel of Saints Cosmas and Damian, in the basilica of Santa Croce in Florence, pending the construction of a monumental tomb. The project encountered the hostility of the ecclesiastical authorities, who pointed out to Grand Duke Ferdinand II (1610-1670) the inappropriateness of building a monument to a man condemned by the Church for "vehement suspicion of heresy." In the following decades, Vincenzo Viviani (1622-1703) campaigned strenuously for the memorial, but failed to overcome ecclesiastical resistance. Only at the end of the reign of Gian Gastone (1671-1737), in 1737, did circumstances permit the inauguration of the monumental tomb of Galileo, visible today on the left when entering the basilica. The sepulchre received the mortal remains of Galileo and of Vincenzo Viviani."
from
http://brunelleschi.imss.fi.it/museum/esim.asp?c=100359


Scientist:
Vincenzo Viviani


Italian mathematician (1622â€"1703)

"Viviani, who was born at Florence in Italy, was an associate and pupil of Galileo, although his chief interest was in mathematics rather than in physics. After the condemnation of Galileo's ideas by the Catholic Church it was unsafe for Viviani to pursue his work on Galileo's mathematics. Accordingly Viviani devoted himself to the thorough study of Greek mathematics, in particular geometry, and in this field of work he achieved wide fame. In 1696 he was elected a fellow of the Royal Society of London. Viviani was particularly interested in trying to reconstruct lost sections of works by ancient Greek mathematicians, such as the missing fifth book of Apollonius's Conics. He also published Italian translations of the works of classical mathematicians including Euclid and Archimedes. He was an associate of the physicist Evangelista Torricelli and collaborated with him in his work on atmospheric pressure and in the invention of the mercury barometer."
from
http://www.answers.com/topic/vincenzo-viviani?cat=technology

So, it was unsafe to pursue mathematical work? And the current Pope harps on about how logical and reasonable his faith is? Hypocrites.

75. Where do US lawmakers stand on science?

Comment #198227 by black wolf on June 23, 2008 at 11:57 am

It's obvious that looking at nature from a design and programming standpoint seems appealing to many engineers. Religious engineers think that fallaciously equivocating DNA with software is sufficient evidence for their worldview. I don't know if they willfully ignore the fact that the bio-chemical processes producing and caused by DNA produce errors of a sort that would simply not happen with properly programmed software, or if it just hasn't occured to them. As I said in a comment to a YouTube video, if their apologetics attributing these errors to sin was valid, they'd have to explain how and when sin does that. If they can't, it's just dishonest asstalk; just like stubbornly maintaining the phlogiston theory would be.

76. Award-winning comedian George Carlin dies

Comment #198122 by black wolf on June 23, 2008 at 8:51 am

Admirable, funny, entertaining. I'll miss him. Every time you think, 'I'd like to have some George Carlin to watch now', you know he's enriched your life.

77. On this Day: Galileo Sentenced for Believing Sun Is Center of Universe

Comment #197849 by black wolf on June 22, 2008 at 7:01 pm

The whole thing is moot anyway since the new pope has rescinded that apology, declaring the persecution of Galileo to have been "reasonable" given the evidence available at that time; apparently Galileo's reasoning and evidence was insufficient to warrant his claims i.e. the new pope has declared Galileo was a bad scientist and was just "lucky" he turned out to be right.

78. 'I despise Islamism': Ian McEwan faces backlash over press interview

Comment #197624 by black wolf on June 22, 2008 at 11:50 am

As my observation of muslims in western countries shows, especially young people from muslim families are more often than not won over by western freedom and lifestyle. They're mostly apolitical, so not very conscious of democratic values and principles in general. A few will always drift to radical ideas and groups, but I'm still confident that a growing majority will embrace secularism as most do in Turkey. The immigrants who don't learn the language of their new home country and refuse to integrate will probably become a diminishing minority - unless certain governments provide them with more support for divisiveness like faith schools.
I'm off to watch the soccer game now, see ya later.

79. The Flea Delusion

Comment #197620 by black wolf on June 22, 2008 at 11:37 am

From the author's bio, he's apparently a qualified psychotherapist, and a business and achievement counselor. His lectures are about emotional and corporate intelligence, communication and mental training.
http://www.taodehaas.com/index.php?incl=Profile

My earlier comment is way off probably. I now speculate his book is more about the emphasis of delusions in our lives, where they come from and what important insights we can potentially gain from realizing them, in order to resolve conflict. Probably denouncing the criticism atheists and faith proponents have for each other as delusions of themselves. As in, delusions are a part of how our mind functions, and getting rid of them is the wrong way to address them. "Tao de Haas has the secret of not just dealing with stress, but making it good for you. Tao's passionate and entertaining teaching methods and effective stress reduction techniques, will leave you relaxed and de-stressed." (http://www.scvb.com.au/scvb/index.cfm?921AE9F0-BCDE-7715-B8DC-1631F2989A0B)
My father is a professional in stress management and business counseling, maybe I'll ask him if he's heard of Mr. de Haas. Probably not, as the market for such counselors is huge.

edit: Thanks Layla for the information in her above post, confirming my ideas.

80. The Flea Delusion

Comment #197588 by black wolf on June 22, 2008 at 11:01 am

Afleogenesis or fleacial creation? The most important question mankind has ever faced!
... or not

I speculate that it's perhaps along the 'we can think about thinking and therefore thought is independent of our brain, so therefore our mind must be somehow inspired by something higher' or 'we wouldn't have the concept of a delusion if we were actually deluded' or something. MPhil will know how to phrase that better than I can, and he'll surely have seen it all before. I'd love to read a review or a comment about its content by my very clever countryman.
I just awoke from a nap, please excuse my poor language.

81. PZ Myers - Science and Atheism in the Blogosphere

Comment #197409 by black wolf on June 22, 2008 at 2:00 am

Ascaphus,
seems like your cousin closed off his mind the moment he realized how fragile and unfounded his faith is. Let's hope that that sense in his mind remains. It might grow over time. Many believers started out exactly like he did, and it took them decades to finally admit their faith was misplaced. Admitting such a fundamental error to yourself is one of the hardest things for our minds, as there are literally biochemical mechanisms blocking such unpleasant experiences. Finding value in abandoning religion often requires realizing the freedom and greater sense of beauty of and our self-determination within the universe this move brings - a sense which is greater than any conception of any god ever devised. Especially a god who requires constant worship, groveling, fear, and arrogantly praising yourself for being the goal and pinnacle of the universe and calling that humility.

82. Open Letter to a victim of Ben Stein's lying propaganda

Comment #197225 by black wolf on June 21, 2008 at 11:54 am

A general comment:
Please people, stop confusing Hawking and Dawkins.
Stephen Hawking - physicist
Richard Dawkins - biologist
They are two different people. Write that down one hundred times.
I see this confusion every day, and it seriously grates on my nerves. Is it really so hard to avoid that sloppy mistake?

83. What Happens When a School Board of Religious Zealots Will 'Lie for Jesus'?

Comment #197218 by black wolf on June 21, 2008 at 11:36 am

mordacious1,
we not only know it's not gonna happen, we know it can not happen by principle. Their superstitions require pushing them on others, and as they've been proudly practicing it for centuries, they target the most vulnerable minds first and foremost.

84. What Happens When a School Board of Religious Zealots Will 'Lie for Jesus'?

Comment #197217 by black wolf on June 21, 2008 at 11:32 am

It's fascinating how often fundamentalists, and even many moderates, pressed for a clear statement, find themselves between two options: lie to yourself or lie to others. If you're a believer, both options mean you're lying to God. Laurie Lebo realized she wasn't going to lie to herself or to others by obfuscating the issue, so she took the step of honesty, which was the step out of a dishonest belief system.

85. Should Strident British Atheist Richard Dawkins Dictate Education Policy to US States? Barbara Forrest Apparently Thinks So

Comment #197176 by black wolf on June 21, 2008 at 9:35 am

How about the headline 'Should Activist Organizations who have Promoted Unconstitutional Education Standards Dictate US Policy? The Discovery Institute Apparently Thinks So'

86. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196887 by black wolf on June 20, 2008 at 2:48 pm

decius,
I've seen a few of the people you describe here in Berlin, but they're a dying species. They are the type of people who feel lost in the modern world. The rapid advance in technology puzzles them, so they decide to revert to ancient 'natural values' by buying into new age crap spread by people who know how to make money (money then used to get all that technology and luxury cars). Even the Green party, where they originally had their political home, left them behind years ago. Green party meetings used to be filled with knitting, sandal-wearing people; today they muster laptops, new mobile phones and suits. Today the most obnoxious smells in streetcars are beer breath and ironically the overpowering stenches of cheap perfume of young and elderly high-class wannabes.

87. Pastors Challenge Law, Endorse Candidates From Pulpit

Comment #196874 by black wolf on June 20, 2008 at 2:20 pm

Seems like pastors like these have gotten bored with preaching the same nonsense year after year, generation after generation. Perhaps unconsciously, they long for some real accomplishment, doing actual work for their money. Demolishing their tax-exempt status will force them to do so.

88. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196515 by black wolf on June 20, 2008 at 5:00 am

Yes, I overlooked or misread that EU/Council thing in my post. Tiredness is my only defence ;). Anyway, at least someone's using clear language without pandering. The more decision makers find that conviction, the better.

baley,
thanks for your comment on my Art. 2. I was thinking of course that omnipresence and all that would make it very easy to fulfill ;).
I'd also add, if said author is not available to support his opinion or provide evidence, then the onus of providing the supporting evidence is on the first guy or the argument's dismissed and deleted from the protocol. I know it's perfectly clear to us, but as we know some people just don't get it.

89. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196410 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 10:26 pm

keith,
The US didn't join because China, Russia and Cuba are members. They were afraid that this would be just another inefficient council. It turns out they were pretty much right in demanding that members should strictly fulfill certain prerequisites.
Currently, a two-thirds majority is needed to exclude a country from the council. The seats are distributed according to regions (13 African, 13 Asian, 6 Eastern Europe, 8 Latin America and the Caribbean, 7 Western Europe and others), elected by the General Assembly.

90. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196401 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 9:44 pm

I'm glad that the EU takes a much clearer and firmer stance:
Resolution 1464 (2005)1
Women and religion in Europe

1. In the lives of many European women, religion continues to play an important role. Whether they are believers or not, most women are affected in one way or another by the attitude of different faiths towards women, directly or through their traditional influence on society or the State.

2. This influence is seldom benign: women's rights are often curtailed or violated in the name of religion. While most religions teach equality of women and men before God, they attribute different roles to women and men on earth. Religiously motivated gender stereotypes have conferred upon men a sense of superiority which has led to discriminatory treatment of women by men and even violence at their hands.

3. At one end of the spectrum lie the extreme violations of women's human rights such as so-called "honour" crimes, forced marriages and female genital mutilation, which â€" although still rare in Europe â€" are on the rise in some communities.

4. At the other end are more subtle and less spectacular forms of intolerance and discrimination which are much more widespread in Europe â€" and which can be just as effective in achieving the subjection of women, such as the refusal to put into question a patriarchal culture which holds up the role of wife, mother and housewife as the ideal, and the refusal to adopt positive measures in favour of women (for example, in parliamentary elections).

5. All women living in Council of Europe member states have a right to equality and dignity in all areas of life. Freedom of religion cannot be accepted as a pretext to justify violations of women's rights, be they open or subtle, legal or illegal, practised with or without the nominal consent of the victims â€" women.

6. It is the duty of the member states of the Council of Europe to protect women against violations of their rights in the name of religion and to promote and fully implement gender equality. States must not accept any religious or cultural relativism of women's human rights. They must not agree to justify discrimination and inequality affecting women on grounds such as physical or biological differentiation based on or attributed to religion. They must fight against religiously motivated stereotypes of female and male roles from an early age, including in schools.

7. The Parliamentary Assembly thus calls on the member states of the Council of Europe to:

7.1. fully protect all women living in their country against all violations of their rights based on or attributed to religion by:

7.1.1. putting into place and enforcing specific and effective policies to fight all violations of women's right to life, to bodily integrity, freedom of movement and free choice of partner, including so-called "honour" crimes, forced marriage and female genital mutilation, wherever and by whomever they are committed, however they are justified, and regardless of the nominal consent of the victim; this means that freedom of religion is limited by human rights;

7.1.2. refusing to recognise foreign family codes and personal status laws based on religious principles which violate women's rights, and ceasing to apply them on their own soil, renegotiating bilateral treaties if necessary;

7.2. take a stand against violations of women's human rights justified by religious or cultural relativism everywhere in the world, including in international fora such as the United Nations or the Inter-Parliamentary Union;

7.3. guarantee the separation between the Church and the State which is necessary to ensure that women are not subjected to religiously inspired policies and laws (for example, in the area of family, divorce, and abortion law);

7.4. ensure that freedom of religion and respect for culture and tradition are not accepted as pretexts to justify violations of women's rights, including when underage girls are forced to submit to religious codes (including dress codes), their freedom of movement is curtailed or their access to contraception is barred by their family or community;

7.5. where religious education is permitted in schools, ensure that this teaching is in conformity with gender equality principles;

7.6. take a stand against any religious doctrine which is antidemocratic or disrespectful of human rights, especially women's rights, and refuse to allow such doctrines to influence political decision making;

7.7. actively promote respect of women's rights, equality and dignity in all areas of life when engaging in dialogue with representatives of different religions, and work on achieving full gender equality in society.

91. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196389 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 8:51 pm

What's complex about it?

92. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196376 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 8:21 pm

Great. The UN Human Rights Council can now no longer comment on widespread human rights violations, including mutilation, torture, rape, the abduction of civilians, the use of child soldiers and massacres.
How so?
see LRA

All it takes is one guy claiming it's a religious topic.

93. Muslim countries win concession regarding religious debates

Comment #196365 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 7:55 pm

There's no need to discuss religious matters in depth at all. There's also no need to respect any opinion that its holder refuses to discuss. I think Islamic countries should unite (they want that, don't they?). The less of them there are, the less they can spit in the face of the world by abusing the UN. If the UN becomes the mouthpiece of those idiots, then I say stop respecting the UN. Let's form a new council, article 1 reading "Opinions that its holder refuses to discuss will not be respected."

Edit: Article 2: "Opinions based on scriptural authority will be accepted only if the author of said scripture presents it personally."

94. Teen's death blamed on faith healing

Comment #196362 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 7:14 pm

"Instead, some jurisdictions require a person who attempts suicide to undergo temporary hospitalization and psychological observation."
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Suicide

Is leaving an apparently grave illness untreated attempted suicide? I think that when an available medical treatment is denied for religious reasons, that religious belief should be considered as equivalent to schizophrenia and manic depression. This justifies declaring a person to be of unsound mind and treated against his will.
Now since such a treatment would almost certainly put the person in severe mental stress for violating God's commandment, which would de-stabilize him further, institutionalization would be in order. Again, the state would be very reluctant to carry this through, because they'd either have to declare the church's teachings false (thus violating freedom of religion), or try to educate what the Bible 'really' means (thus endorsing one religious view over another).
What a clusterfuck.

edit: quote fixed

95. Teen's death blamed on faith healing

Comment #196358 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 7:01 pm

addendum: I just looked it up. Abetting suicide (in my un-lawyerly opinion clearly the case here) is a crime. The parents and the church could not have known if there was a terminal illness or not, or if it was untreatable or not. Since they clearly state anyway that no illness, terminal or otherwise, is permitted to be treated as per God's decree, they are guilty in my opinion. I think the main reason for the state's inconsequential treatment of this sort of religious views is the fear to put the validity or veracity of Biblical scripture into question.

96. Teen's death blamed on faith healing

Comment #196353 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 6:48 pm

hmcook87,
note that the kid chose not to be treated himself. Some countries can declare someone to be of unsound mind or insane, and then carry out the medical treatment. But if, as the report indicates, he didn't go see a doctor because of his faith, there was no opportunity to file for state custodianship until it he was dead. The only way to save the children of this church of fucktardary is to declare the whole membership insane and take the children away from them. But apparently religious freedom is still more valuable than the life of several hundreds of children (and insane adults).

97. Teen's death blamed on faith healing

Comment #196351 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 6:39 pm

When a company makes a product, and the intended use of that product causes the user's death, the company gets sued for millions. Yet when a religious teaching is carried out exactly the way it has been taught, the parents get sued (and rightfully so), but the church carries on.
"Yes, sir, we told the people to put a fuse in their gas tank and light it. But they're responsible if they actually do it. Of course we also told them God would punish them if they didn't. But it's not our fault God wrote that down."
I have no words for the pernicious rationalizations they engage in. They tell the people that this is God's Law, and any disobedience will have the gravest consequences imaginable, and then evade responsibility when people die because they follow that Law. Isn't instigation of manslaughter a crime too? It's high time proper consequences are drawn.

98. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #196327 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 4:35 pm

Predicting what will be most "fit" tomorrow is as beyond our powers as predicting the weather on March 4th 2012.

99. The Mother, The Child, The School Board And The Psychic

Comment #196014 by black wolf on June 19, 2008 at 7:58 am

I'd like to see every member of that board and the psychic each convicted to pay the woman $2,000 per month for the next three years. Sounds fair to me, and the psychic will at least put some of the money she wangles to good use. Year after year, I keep up the hope that decisive legislation will be passed to have psychics provide scientifically sound evidence of their asserted abilities before being allowed to practice.

100. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #195720 by black wolf on June 18, 2008 at 5:52 pm

RtG,

Regarding the dam. If I saw a rock roll into a stream, then by observation, I would reason that it was just a rock that rolled into a stream naturally creating a dam.