1351. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252350 by Wosret on September 23, 2008 at 1:24 am

879. Comment #252346 by Styrer-

My excuse for what?

1352. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252348 by Wosret on September 23, 2008 at 1:21 am

877. Comment #252344 by Bonzai

I know, it makes no sense to me either. Fundamentalists are the most intellectually dishonest people I've ever seen. They are capable of astonishing cognitive dissonance, and yet they are suppose to be ultra consistent when it comes to their religions. These people are masters at warping things to be what they want them to be.

I personally couldn't care less about reforming Islam, nor do I think that it is compatible with democracy or freedom, but neither is Christianity. It hasn't changed. That's the same book it's been for five hundred years. People just don't pay attention to most of it anymore. They read vague, out of context excerpts and divine special meanings from them. There is no reason that Muslims can't do the same thing.

Even almost all fundamentalist Christians still reject the super crazy stuff found in Leviticus and Deuteronomy. Most of them don't endorse slavery or think women deserve less rights and freedoms. This shows that even the fundamentalist Christians are not all that fundamental, and are considerably liberal compared to a fundamentalist of a hundred years ago.

The religion, or bible hasn't changed or been reformed. People just read it differently now, and let secular society inform how they interpret it to varying degrees. There is absolutely no reason why Muslims can't also do this.

1353. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252345 by Wosret on September 23, 2008 at 1:07 am

876. Comment #252343 by Styrer-

I see now why you were mocked for calling Steve emotional...

1354. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252337 by Wosret on September 23, 2008 at 12:33 am

866. Comment #252332 by Fanusi Khiyal

You clearly, and completely misunderstood what Bonzai just said.

The trouble, Bonzai is firstly doctrinal: judaism is exclusive to one people, it isn't a conquering and proselytizing faith the way Islam is. Secondly, the jews were always a weak minority.

The second problem is that, even "moderate Muslims" can revert to full-blown jihadi mentality with no warning.

Basically the way I view the Muslims as a whole is that they seem largely divided between those who support Jihad and Shariah and those who do absolutely nothing to stop them. The real Tiny Minority Of Extremists isn't the Jihad supporters, but those who speak out against the Jihad. They just aren't enough to stop it, especially since they are much closer to ex-Muslims or apostates.

1355. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252323 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 10:14 pm

858. Comment #252320 by Brian English

I've thought perhaps lack of life experience. I notice that those of the more liberal persuasion seem to have far more interesting stories to tell. Also tend to have suffered persecution or discrimination of some kind for being in the minority about something.

For instance, how many of the homosexuals/traps/reverse traps on the site espouse conservative views? Not a single one that I've heard. I'm not so much a sexual deviant as I am a an outcast of other sorts, but I think that experiencing even mild forms of what you want to unleash on others is the fastest and most definitive way to come to appreciate the reality of what you are promoting.

1356. Ancient underwater reef found in SA's Flinders Ranges

Comment #252322 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 10:04 pm

This is cool. I hope they find out some interesting things from this, and then tell us all about it. Science ftw.

1357. When Atheists Attack

Comment #252319 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 9:52 pm

Man, Islamists scare the crap outta me...but then, so do right-wingers of any kind. They all seem to wanna kill people for what they believe, and/or enforce laws criminalizing beliefs. They just see themselves as fundamentally different because they are "right". If any of them had their way I would be very worried about being seen as "wrong".

Mostly they seem to operate out of the same area of the brain anyway (someone said "reptile"...sounds right to me) so they all seem to come to similar conclusions from different starting points. The difference is small. Whether it's an insane Muslim nuking Israel, or an insane christian nuking Pakistan, it makes little difference, the end result is the same.

1358. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251759 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 3:44 am

515. Comment #251753 by Sargeist

Only if person C is awesome. I'm person C.

1359. Richard Dawkins infected with Satanic 'virus of mind', Christian group claims

Comment #251729 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 2:01 am

Goons.

1360. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251721 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 1:40 am

My post "170. Comment #251185 by Mitchell Gilks" shows that Robertson is wrong about this guy at the very least.

Though, who knows who he is referring to? He just kinda makes big wild accusations, not directed at anyone in particular and hopes someone picks it up.

1361. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251718 by Wosret on September 22, 2008 at 1:36 am

Rockets me to the top. Once everyone sees how unimpressive I can be, I'm sure to earn a place in that pantheon of mediocrity.

1362. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251683 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 11:19 pm

People have this idea that you have to be an intellectual, or reasonable to be an atheist. You do not. I do not expect other atheists to agree with me, or think someone is smart or a good person all because they are an atheist. I frankly think such a notion is moronic.

I've heard far too much insanity and idiocy espoused round these parts to hold to such a notion.

Anyone who think that Palin is comparable to Obama in aptitude, is frankly an idiot. There is not much more to be said. There are several articles, and lots of information about her, and her views on this very site. Surely they know of them.

Anyone who thinks that McCain is comparable in aptitude to Obama is also any idiot. Experience doesn't equal qualified, or apt. If that were the case, every president running for the second term should win, because they have the experience, and Bush should be far more qualified than any of them, because he has been president for eight years. Such thinking is ridiculous. McCain is an old man, who's brain, in his old age, has shrunken to the size of a three year old's, and has a one in three chance of kicking the bucket in his first term. His age alone makes him unqualified.

Obama is by no means perfect, and there are good and valid criticisms against him, but he is by far a better choice than the alternative. Anyone who does not appreciate this, I think, is frankly stupid.

I can't really form an argument for this, surely the people posting her already know all of the facts about all of them...so the only thing I can say is that if you know about all of these candidates, and still think that McCain is the best pick, then I think that this shows a flimsy grasp of the state of the world, and lack of basic reasoning skills.

(*steps off soap box*).

1363. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251647 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 8:37 pm

476. Comment #251644 by BrandySpears

The pride of the ignorant, cow-eyed, bible bashing, gun-totting, dew-bellies.

1364. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251634 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:41 pm

Obama wants to enslave the white race. This is a plan that has been in motion for decades.

Better vote McCain, or you will be in chains.

That's his new slogan.

1365. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251224 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 8:11 am

203. Comment #251221 by Sargeist

Of course I'm worried about Iran. I am quite capable of being worried about the psychopath next door, and the one down the street at the same time. He seems to be saying that we are only allowed to worry about one.

1366. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251222 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 8:09 am

200. Comment #251217 by Bonzai

I see that I misspelled "unleash" by using a completely different word. I do that a lot.

1367. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251218 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 8:06 am

198. Comment #251215 by ColdFusionLazarus

I've said that I was an intellectual-anarchist, but that is not the same thing. That is someone who is completely against any form of governing ideas, or making thought crimes. I am an anarchist in that sense, and to that extent, but not a political or social anarchist. Those are quite different things.

1368. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251216 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 8:03 am

Sam's argument, if I remember correctly, was basically that if you are willing to allow for collateral damage, when you bomb areas with a citizenry then you should be willing to torture first. His basic premise was that killing people is less bad than torturing them. This then did not mean that he took a cavalier approach to either. He didn't suggest that then either should be done at all. It was just in the basic idea, that if you are willing to kill, then you should be willing to torture first. He didn't actually advocate either.

1369. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251214 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:56 am

194. Comment #251211 by Fanusi Khiyal

My mind is boggled for you...what is the point? Does allowing the US to have a president that might unleash a nuclear holocaust somehow make Iran so it won't? What the hell? Supposing ten countries were in a position that they might do this...does it then become better with an eleventh? I don't understand your thinking at all...

1370. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251208 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:45 am

179. Comment #251194 by ColdFusionLazarus

What the hell are you talking about? I'm not an anarchist, nor do I want freedom from moral constraints... I'm going to stop responding to you now.

1371. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251206 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:44 am

180. Comment #251195 by Bonzai

I completely agree with you on morality. I think it can be treated like a system of logic. As long as we have clear goals in mind, then it is quite possible to do that.

(*edit*) I should also mention that I use ethics and morality synonymously.

1372. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251201 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:39 am

178. Comment #251193 by Sargeist

The basic idea for why it is a very bad idea to get the army involved is because the army isn't a perfect benevolent force for good. They are individuals, many of which are retarded. While they are occupying another country, they murder, they rape, and they steal. They also do a hefty amount of drugs themselves. They are nearly impossible to keep in check themselves. Such an action would result in less regulation of state officials, and more over all crime and violence. Often perpetrated by those suppose to be upholding the law.

It takes a whole lot of checks and balances just to keep state official from stepping over the line. The less prepared, and the larger amount, the higher level of trouble.

We have also come a long way to attempt to get the right balance between society protection, and personal freedoms. It is a delicate balance, where one is inevitably traded for the other to some degree no matter which way you go. What you suggest would cost a hefty amount of those personal freedoms, and would just increase social problems.

There are several other problems with the idea, but I don't want to write too extensively on it.

1373. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251192 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:29 am

173. Comment #251188 by ColdFusionLazarus

I don't see why you are addressing that comment to me. I specified "insane right-wing views". Unless you don't consider those views right-wing, then I don't understand the point of your post to me.

1374. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251189 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:25 am

172. Comment #251187 by Bonzai

You forgot to explain that the idea is bad. You seemed to assume that he would just gather that from your example...but he just advocated killing people in their homes for drug possession. So...

1375. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251185 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:17 am

168. Comment #251183 by ColdFusionLazarus

It matters far less to me whether they believe in a god or not than whether they hold such insane right-wing views. I'd vote for a sane theist long before I'd vote for an insane atheist.

Nothing says atheists have to be rational, or sane. Or that theists have to be irrational and insane, that merely only appears to be generally the case.

1376. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251180 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 7:09 am

162. Comment #251177 by Fanusi Khiyal

Yes, that is what insane means. Holding a point of view that differs from the sane.

Though I'd hardly call anything I've put forward to you "discourse". I save that for the sane.

1377. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251174 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 6:56 am

156. Comment #251170 by Fanusi Khiyal

I was quite serious when I said that I can't tell when you're joking. You say such insane things that it is impossible to tell when you aren't serious.

1378. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251168 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 6:48 am

144. Comment #251157 by Fanusi Khiyal

You must be presupposing that morality connotes absolute right and wrongness. There is even no such thing as absolute factual right and wrongness. It is only a problem if you think such assertions carry such a connotation...when I don't think that they have to, nor do I mean them to when I espouse them, and I am confident that Decius doesn't either.

1379. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251158 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 6:35 am

142. Comment #251154 by Fanusi Khiyal

For all the possible reasons I have for not liking you, I think that my inability to tell when you're joking is at the top of the list.

1380. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251155 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 6:33 am

139. Comment #251151 by Sargeist

In that sense, and to that extent; I am a happy bigot.

132. Comment #251142 by decius

There is no such thing as absolute right and wrong...though since you never even remotely implied that there were...I don't know why I'm telling you this...

1381. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251127 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 5:29 am

118. Comment #251126 by Fanusi Khiyal

I think that I elucidate that quite clearly in my review of it. I scored it the lowest I've ever scored a series.

Though I only claimed to be "leet" facetiously. I'm actually poor and uneducated. I'm not elite in any sense.

1382. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251123 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 5:22 am

Get a room, you two...

1383. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251108 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 5:03 am

98. Comment #251105 by Sargeist

I think "insane" describes you better.

1384. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251107 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 5:00 am

90. Comment #251096 by Fanusi Khiyal

I'm leet son, I pwn ur face.

1385. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #251102 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 4:54 am

64. Comment #251038 by Titania

Lol...so you think that she physically grabbed him, knocked him off his feet, and dragged him, like a sack of potatoes, out of the room, and then physically forced him to his knees, and made him pray?

I think that you have a vivid imagination.

1386. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251094 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 4:42 am

I'm confused...what do you people mean by "elitism"? Why is it derogatory?

It seems quite strange to me to say that he didn't "defend elitism" when it appears to me that he very much did. He says "how has "elitism" become a bad word in American politics?" He is clearly saying that he does not think that it is a bad word.

1387. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251086 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 4:11 am

77. Comment #251082 by BrandySpears

Yeah, but it isn't as if she is going to nuke America, so it's cool. She will just nuke all of those evil non-Americans. Who cares about them?

80. Comment #251085 by Titania

I promote elitism in general, and I think he does too.

1388. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251081 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 4:04 am

I'd stay on your high horse, Laurie, and not slush around in the muck with him.

1389. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251080 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 4:01 am

51. Comment #251051 by Richard Dawkins

Yeah, it is hard to not conclude that the title was not his idea, though, like some others, I thought that the subtitle was worse.

The brilliance of Sam's writing quickly made me forget about the title though.

1390. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251039 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 2:55 am

45. Comment #251037 by dochmbi

Hey, there is a requirement. You have to be super-rich.

1391. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251034 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 2:44 am

38. Comment #251027 by rod-the-farmer

I didn't know that Budapest was the capitol of Hungary either. I'm really bad at remembering names and places. When I started learning the names of the countries in Japanese, it was especially hard, because they show you the flag, and you are suppose to say their names in Japanese, but I didn't know what countries half of the flags belonged to.

On your question, I don't know if you are naive or not, but I'd rather not take the risk.

1392. When Atheists Attack

Comment #251030 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 2:34 am

ATP is a Palin fan. Looks like Sam is writing his own prophecies "Her fans seem inclined to forgive her any indiscretion short of cannibalism. However badly she may stumble during the remaining weeks of this campaign, her supporters will focus their outrage upon the journalist who caused her to break stride" -Article.

Wow is he good.

1393. When Atheists Attack

Comment #250983 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 1:04 am

I absolutely love to read Sam's writing. I wish he would write another book already, so I could read it.

I share his fears, though I'm Canadian, and have my own election to worry a-boot. I fear we're both screwed. "The end of days", a self fulfilling prophecy...I hope not.

1394. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250975 by Wosret on September 21, 2008 at 12:35 am

58. Comment #250965 by Laurie Fraser

I give my students (15 - adult) a pat on the shoulder every now and then. I don't care about "appropriate" and "inappropriate" labels anymore

1395. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250958 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 10:57 pm

51. Comment #250953 by Titania

I think that you have to interpret that excerpt strangely to think that it says that anything physical at all happened. Where I come from to "drag" someone around is used hyperbolically. In order to actually drag him, he would have to be off his feet. I find it frankly silly to interpret that as you have. Maybe she was physical, I don't know, but I find nothing in that article that suggests that she was, and I think that if she was it would be worth mentioning. It would also be clearly illegal, and I would think that criminal charges would have unquestionably followed.

People are pointing out that if it were religious people they would freak out...so? Does that then warrant freaking out? If you say "well religious people would do X" then that makes me want to think twice about doing X, not follow suit.

1396. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250944 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 9:20 pm

38. Comment #250936 by Titania

It does not say that she physically forced him to do anything. Nor does the kids parent raise that as an issue. You just continue to assert that, and seem to ignored me when I said that if it is true, then I agree, but that is another issue.

39. Comment #250938 by ggab7768

This article is about the praying, and that is what people are upset about. If you think she should be fired for physically forcing him to do something and for demeaning him in front of his peers, then that is what you should say. The making him pray seems a great deal lesser to me. I was saying that you cannot use them as a smoke screen for saying that the making him pray was worth her firing and legal action.

The article did not elucidate, or raise an objection to anything but the making him pray. I don't agree that that in itself is worth her job. There could be elements that I don't know about, and no one in the article objected to that were, but I cannot be blamed for not knowing them.

I just think that people should think about this, and decide if such a punishment fits the crime. Is this kid now damaged enough that there needs to be legal action taken, and the woman being removed from teaching ever again. I really don't think so.

1397. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250934 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 8:45 pm

36. Comment #250932 by Titania

I realize, that is why it is an abuse of her authority. Should it not be punished like any other abuse of her authority? Why is this special? I don't understand why people think that causes harm worth her complete ruination. As long as she didn't do anything illegal, or make the kid do anything illegal...then the only thing I see that needs punishment is the abuse of authority.

1398. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250929 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 8:35 pm

26. Comment #250912 by sidelined

If that is true, that she physically forced him to then I agree, but then the issue is physical coercion, not the fact that she made him pray. Right?

In any case, is doesn't say that she physically forced him to do anything in the article.

28. Comment #250915 by ggab7768

Your objection is also to something besides the actual praying. So you can't use this as a smoke screen for that.

1399. Look Who's Irrational Now

Comment #250927 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 8:30 pm

I've just been converted too! All of my questions were answered perfectly, and absolute proof was offered. So yeah, I started believing it. You all should too. Praise the god of poorly composed music. My pennants for doubting, is having to listen to more poorly composed music. Be merciful oh lord!

This article is absurd. It operates on the premise that their religion doesn't count as superstition, when it very much does. Their religion is superstition, conspiracy theorizing, pseudo-science all rolled up into one. The reason religious people are less likely to believe in other superstitions is because their imaginary friend forbids it...not for rational reasons. Your numbers don't mean anything when you read them however you want, count everything you don't believe as superstitious and don't bother to outline the reason for why this is.

Also, Spinoza is right...anyone who says that just doesn't understand the problem. Religion is a result of irrationality, not the other way around. Getting rid of one subset of irrational ideas does not stifle irrationality itself.

1400. Art teacher made student pray to Jesus for forgiveness

Comment #250904 by Wosret on September 20, 2008 at 7:33 pm

They should string here up! Boil her in oil! Stretch her entrails out along the school with horses! Put her in that rat helmet from 1984! Show her naked pictures of her family members! Make her watch Jerry springer the opera! Give her several unnecessary surgeries!

C'mon... what she did was irresponsible and idiotic, but it is hardly worth her ruination. Abusing one's authority should be punished, as it would be for in such case. I fail to see why it is so much worse when you make someone pray to your imaginary friend. We don't have our own imaginary friend being offended like they do, so I don't think that it is all that big a deal.

She abused her authority, and should be punished, I agree with that. Though I don't think she should lose her job over a single case of this... if she is known to abuse her authority, or does it again, then she should lose her job over it. Other than that, lighten up.