101. Turkish Islamic author given 3-year jail sentence

Comment #180924 by esuther on May 16, 2008 at 6:20 am

Blackwolf,

You wrote:
>>>It seems they're trying to do with Freemasonry exactly what Hitler (no this is not a Godwin) did with the German Worker's Party. Get in there, sway or coerce a majority, take over the leadership, and then reform the statutes (and the organization's name) to fit your ideology. Then proceed to do the same thing with your country. Then your neighboring countries. People like these always move to criminal behavior sooner or later.<<<

I'm sorry, I don't understand your post. Could you elaborate? Who is "they" you say are infiltrating Freemasonry? The Islamic fundamentalists oppose Freemasonry the same way they do Zionism, so 'they' can't refer to them. Who then is 'they'? And what good would it do them to take over an organization of silly old men with secret handshakes?

Thanks,

102. Turkish Islamic author given 3-year jail sentence

Comment #180871 by esuther on May 16, 2008 at 2:18 am

To Turkish_Scientist

Thanks for your thorough description of the Harun Yahya phenomenon. I had no idea.

But what's up with this Freemasonry thing? I thought Freemasons were a club of beer-bellied old men with secret handshakes, monthly meetings by candlelight and no visible agenda. Am I missing something here?

103. Is Science Killing the Soul?

Comment #180866 by esuther on May 16, 2008 at 1:51 am

Platonists, Paleo and Neo. I have a question for you.

I am working on a novel that takes place in Renaissance Rome and â€" besides a lot of sex and violence -- has various characters discussing Neo-platonism (although they don't call it that). There seem to be a couple of specialists here who are more familiar with neo-platonism then I am and so I'd be grateful for some guidance.
As I understand it, Neoplationism, in its various permutations, refers to the presence of the 'divine' (whatever that is) in humans and nature. That being the case, how do we separate out Neo-platonism from pantheism, Christian mysticism, sufism, New-age-ism, animism, and just plain voodoo?

What, specifically, is 'platonic' about Neo-platonism, that distinguishes it from all the other forms of divine immanence?

Cartomancer? Brian? MPhil? Anyone?

Help would be much appreciated.

104. On Fitna, the Movie

Comment #178869 by esuther on May 12, 2008 at 7:12 am

When the discussion is of "Islamic countries" I always reach for my (metaphorical) gun.
The term is as meaningless as "Christian countries." The best example of this stereotyping error is Turkey. As far as I know, Turkey is for all intents and purposes secular. I have read no reports of Muslim Brotherhood organizations developing there or of mullahs attempting to influence the political process.

When I worked in a financial services corporation in Manhattan, I had a colleague, a Turkish citizen, whom I often engaged on the subject of religion. She identified as Muslim the same way as half the people in the office identified as Jews or Christians, that is, she engaged in only the most superficial holiday observances, and used the religious term as cultural reference. Her primary interest, like everyone elses, was to make a career and lots of bucks.

Every time the discussion is of "Muslims," I think of her.

105. Atheists are nice people who will roast in hell, says Cardinal

Comment #178289 by esuther on May 11, 2008 at 5:07 am

For purposes of definition: reason is the process of deriving information from one of two sources:

a) Inductive reasoning: i.e. experimentation, accumulation of evidence. The sun has risen every day I have ever witnessed. Therefore I can say with extreme likelihood (but not certainty) that it will rise again tomorrow. Even if it is cloudy or so stormy that I can't see the light, I can assume by experience that the sun has risen.

b) Deductive reasoning: the obtaining of information contained WITHIN already known facts. This can be known with certainty (if the preliminary information is certain) but adds depth of understanding rather than new information.
The classic example is the syllogism: Socrates is a man. All men are mortal. Thus (by deductive reasoning) Socrates is mortal.

Fides, do not try to engage me in further discussion on this. I consider you a troll, not a serious searcher for information. This is just to give you the dictionary definition of reason so you will shut the hell up.

106. Judge orders La. school district to stop Bible giveaways

Comment #167357 by esuther on April 24, 2008 at 12:15 am

I got a little white "wedding bible" as a prize for perfect sunday school attendance. Didn't seem to have the desired effect though. Never wedded (lesbian here) and dumped religion altogether round about the end of junior high school.
I still have the bible forty years later -- filled with yellow marker underlines. It comes in handy for picking out great quotes for my atheist fiction. As RD points out, it is part of the cultural vocabulary.
While I of course find the idea of handing out bibles in a public school objectionable, I suspect precious few school kids actually sit down in their free time and read them - not when there's other cool stuff to do.

107. Sexpelled: No Intercourse Allowed

Comment #163238 by esuther on April 18, 2008 at 5:02 am

Stork theory does have its advantages since it is, by its very nature 'safe', while icky sex can sometimes be hazardous. I came across this old video warning about unsafe sex and offering safe alternatives.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLejEZ2KYs0&NR=1

Good suggestions, all of them, but it is better to wait for the stork and not worry about the danger at all. What a relief.

108. School bars same-sex partners at formals

Comment #162006 by esuther on April 16, 2008 at 1:58 am

I have to shake my head at all this bible bothering. Ortho jews and xtians love to dash back to their skripchures to check what skyman wants them to do and then weigh whether it's worth it. Stone queers? Sure, let's keep doing that, but not the adulturers or the pork eaters or the masterbators.
Buuuuut,(as Mitchell will be happy to note) nowhere in the sky-messages is lesbianism mentioned, EXCEPT in the very cozy relationship between Naomi and Ruth. Check it out. Seems like if you are a really pious young woman, you should hook up with some hot older woman in the family and pledge eternal love (and sleep at the foot of her bed).
Whew. Is it hot in here, or what?

109. Ancient serpent shows its leg

Comment #159931 by esuther on April 13, 2008 at 12:24 pm

VeryLee,

>>>>Jesus had better not pop up in an islamic country, unless he wants to go thru all that again! <<<

I see your point VeryLee, but you miss the mark by assuming Islam would be more hostile to (the 'real')Jesus than the other two Abrahamitic religions. In fact, Islam recognizes Jesus as a prophet. Judaism does not recognize him at all. He would therefore be most unwelcome in any of the orthodox Jewish settlements in the occupied West Bank. I daresay, he would seriously embarrass the folks in Rome too.
Come to think of it, probably in the prayer breakfasts in the White House too.

110. Richard Dawkins and Bill Maher

Comment #159772 by esuther on April 13, 2008 at 5:09 am

To Julius,

Well, all religions have a certain amount of theater, don't they? It's always a thrill to be part of a pageant and the Catholic Church, because it is so rich, has probably the best pageants of all. But if it's the frisson of being part of a major spectacle that turns you on, you should consider making the pilgrimage to Mecca. Just imagine what goes through the mind of a man who is circling the Kabba stone shoulder to shoulder with ten thousand other believers. If he had the slightest shred of doubt before coming, he will lose it then.
My point is that the thrill of spectacle is a dangerous thing. It ramps up the emotions and crowds out the rational part of the brain. (In my personal case, when I hear the final measures of the Hallelujah Chorus, my atheism gets locked in a closet for a few moments.

Why don't you just go more often to the opera? I would suggest Tosca for starters.

111. Richard Dawkins and Bill Maher

Comment #159373 by esuther on April 12, 2008 at 3:38 am

Regarding the laugh track, ALL laughter in those news-comedy shows is fake, or at leased forced. I used to live in Manhattan and was in the 'studio audience" of two shows. Before the show gets started/taping,there are 'warmer-uppers' who get the audience fired up. We were told that it is a comedy show that depends on our enthusiastic response to remarks, so they actually rehearse the audience laughter. So whether a laugh track is added or cued makes no real difference: it's all part of infotainment.

112. Faith healing church parents charged over toddler's death

Comment #153579 by esuther on April 1, 2008 at 3:39 pm

Teapot

You have created a straw man. Have fun knocking it down. It will make you feel very brave.

Esuther

113. Police: Girl Dies After Parents Pray for Healing Instead of Seeking Medical Help

Comment #151086 by esuther on March 28, 2008 at 6:27 am

193. Comment #150974 by nancy on March 27, 2008

what abut voodoo then? What if my child is sick but I am performing some black magic ritual known only to a small number of people? is that protected too? What neglect that one can attribute to any dogma cannot be protected? where do they draw the line? how big does the religion have to be to get the special privilege that its members can kill their kids through neglect?
---------------------

Yeah, I was wondering about this too. What if the parents had been Wiccan and prayed to the Goddess? Even the US military recognized Wicca as a religion. But imagine how fast the law would slap those parents in jail if it were THAT myth they bought into.
I have the feeling that this homicide gets a 'pass' because it is from the mainstream religion, (albeit the idiot fringe of that religion) So they still get credit for being 'well-meaning' Christians, rather than negligent criminals.

Esuther

114. Fossil find could be Europe's first humans

Comment #150710 by esuther on March 27, 2008 at 9:41 am

Thanks DBA

I did a brief check through the "Recent News" and did not see any reference to the news report, but I did not look through the commentaries, and I overlooked the forums (fora?).
I should have known that nothing as egregious as this would escape your notice.

Esuther

115. Fossil find could be Europe's first humans

Comment #150676 by esuther on March 27, 2008 at 8:45 am

This video was posted on Alternet today. It shows Creationist teachers taking school kids to the Denver Museum for a debunking tour of the "theory" of evolution. Frightening, really.

http://www.alternet.org/blogs/video/#80595

Almost as infuriating as the videotape is the NBC lead-in which treats the two sides as if they were two completely reasonable intellectual positions being taken in a never-ending squabble.

I'm getting a little tire of this 'fair and balanced' shit which pretends that cumulative reason and infantile fantasies have an equal claim to one's respect.

esuther

116. Police: Girl Dies After Parents Pray for Healing Instead of Seeking Medical Help

Comment #149787 by esuther on March 26, 2008 at 8:23 am

There are other lunatic sects in the US which refuse medical treatment, for themselves and for their children, and surely there have been similar cases which have created legal precedents. I seem to remember a case where a blood transfusion was refused and the child died, but I can't remember where. Unfortunately, I believe (correct me if anyone knows better) these would be state laws, and thus not uniform throughout the US.

Regardless of the legal outcome, it is clearly the most extreme (and poignant) example of what RD refers to as the religious abuse of children. I am aghast that the other children are allowed to remain in the home. Surely at some point or other, one of them will get sick.

Esuther

117. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #148814 by esuther on March 24, 2008 at 1:56 am

hmm. I obviously haven't mastered the technique of cutting and pasting segments from other postings into my post. I hope y'all could see that I was responding to Stevencarr and not just repeating his post.
I'll get it right eventually. It's what I get for lurking all the time, rather than posting.

Esuther

118. Lying for Jesus?

Comment #148813 by esuther on March 24, 2008 at 1:52 am

To Stevencarrwork

Hitler explicity rejected Darwinism and the evolution of man.

From Hitler's Tischgespraeche for 1942 'Woher nehmen wir das Recht zu glauben, der Mensch sei nicht von Uranfaengen das gewesen , was er heute ist? Der Blick in die Natur zeigt uns, dass im Bereich der Pflanzen und Tiere Veraenderungen und Weiterbildungen vorkommen. Aber nirgends zeigt sich innherhalb einer Gattung eine Entwicklung von der Weite des Sprungs, den der Mensch gemacht haben muesste, sollte er sich aus einem affenartigen Zustand zu dem, was er ist, fortgebildet haben.'

I shall translate Hitler's words, which were recored by the stenographer.

'From where do we get the right to believe that man was not from the very beginning what he is today.

A glance in Nature shows us , that changes and developments happen in the realm of plants and animals. But nowhere do we see inside a kind, a development of the size of the leap that Man must have made, if he supposedly has advanced from an ape-like condition to what he is' (now)



And in the entry for 27 February 1942 , Hitler says 'Das, was der Mensch von dem Tier voraushat, der veilleicht wunderbarste Beweis fuer die Ueberlegenheit des Menschen ist, dass er begriffen hat, dass es eine Schoepferkraft geben muss.'

Hitler was a creationist....



Thank you for this nice piece of research proving in Adolf's own words that he was a NOT a Darwinist. An excellent riposte to those who babble on about genocidal superman policies being the logical outcome of an understanding of Darwinian evolution. (Rather in the same line of argument as "Stalin proves atheists are murderers")

Darwinism is an explanation the evolution of life. Social/political Darwinism is a human invention to justify the supremacy of the momentarily mighty. An unfortunate theft of the name Darwin for a malicious program.

Esuther

119. Sci-fi guru Clarke to have secular funeral

Comment #147627 by esuther on March 21, 2008 at 3:02 am

I don't have a religion, but I DO have an ego, so I have asked my loved ones (the ones who will inherit at least some of my money) to cremate me and then have a party at which they are required to say good things about me. Of course I can't control what they say, but they are delighted that I will be paying for the party so that should help.
In addition, since I have no children, but I HAVE written novels -- and thus have intellectual progeny -- I have asked my heirs to be sure to distribute lots of my novels as souvenirs to people at the party. Everyone love reading a posthumous writer, right? A pity I won't see the royalties.

esuther (writing as Justine Saracen)

120. God's cure for gays lost in sin

Comment #147300 by esuther on March 20, 2008 at 6:08 am

To al rawandi and others puzzling over the natural selection effects of homosexuality:

I think this question pre-supposes a binary choice, either an individual is homo or hetero, when in fact it is pretty much accepted that the causes of sexuality (not the sexual act) are multiple and varied and produce a range of behaviors rather than only one or the other Thus, there may be a survival benefit to a community which as 'batchelor' members, such as wolves or bats, who do infant care while the parents are elsewhere. I am not a biologist here, and so am only throwing out an idea.

Also, the notion (and possibly a myth) that gay people have particular artistic sensibilities suggests that it could also be an element that has survived through the generations because of being coupled with some other trait which does have survivability.

In any case, clearly it does have some function in the human population since it does appear to have existed since ancient times (often in the face of great obstacles). Another reason to accept that a person can't be talked out of it.

esuther

121. God's cure for gays lost in sin

Comment #147286 by esuther on March 20, 2008 at 5:37 am

I confess here before god and everyone, that I LIVE the homosexual lifestyle.

Here is my typical homosexual day:

Wake up from my vice-ridden lesbian bed.
Eat lesbian oatmeal
Wash my lesbian dishes
Give a big lesbian hug to my cat
Get dressed in my butch lesbian pantsuit (unlike the pantsuits of heterosexual women of course)
Go to the office and work for eight hours, stiffling my urges to do other lesbian things
Come home and shop for lesbian food in the supermarket
Do lesbian laundry with special queer soap
Surf the internet looking for lesbian recipes
Cook a lesbian dinner
Call my lesbian friends and ask what queer things they have been up to lately,
Get in my vice-ridden lesbian bed and read a lesbian novel until I fall asleep and have lesbian dreams.

Disgusting isn't it?

esuther

122. Bishop accuses gays of 'conspiracy' against the Catholic Church

Comment #145676 by esuther on March 18, 2008 at 1:32 am

Mitchell,

I spent a week with a team of Jewish doctors in the West Bank last year, and the team went on to work in Gaza. They were welcomed warmly by Palestinians with whom they worked and spoke. You are perpetuating a myth that Muslems uniformly hate Jews and that a Jew is de facto in danger within (apparently anonymous) Muslim communities.

It is true that some Arabs (and millions of non-Arabs) have an abiding bitterness against the Israeli occupation of Palestine and the outrageous financial support Israel gets from the US, enabling it to continue its expansion. That is not to be equated with murderous intent against Jews, only a very logical anger against the expansionism of a racist state and those who support it. Please be a little more factual when you hold up contemporary Jews as victims -- that is, as al rawandi requests, please provide some examples.

esuther

123. Mother Nature is Not Our Friend

Comment #105954 by esuther on January 2, 2008 at 8:03 am

Ashton has a good point. One of the major social changes in the last half century is the increasing control of our lives (food quality, environment, education, government, foreign policy) by profit-seeking corporations. I can easily envision gene-manipulation for profit and do not see how this can improve the lot of the human race, only that of the controlling classes.

A secondary concern to me, a gay person, is the possiblility of gene-manipulation attempts to control sexual preference. Even in social environments where gays are accepted, potential parents are rarely neutral on the subject. While no one is ever going to genetically control race, there are many who openly espouse genetic control of sexual preference.

I suppose any such objections are moot, however, since it was ever so that if scientists and technicians COULD do something, they did it.