201. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #137564 by mikejswalker on March 3, 2008 at 6:59 am

peace,
it requires great strength to sit across from oneself and observe the
the 'not so tender moments'. I can only hope.

202. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #137305 by mikejswalker on March 2, 2008 at 4:11 pm

man, i figured there was history. But that shit must be deep. Cunt is very strong. It saddens me that it gets to this.

203. Fleabytes

Comment #137298 by mikejswalker on March 2, 2008 at 4:02 pm

what happened to the 19 yar old student who didn't know what to believe etc? pmurdoch?

204. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #137280 by mikejswalker on March 2, 2008 at 3:43 pm

It's a question of degree- 'hey don't you think you're being a little over-sensitive there scooter?' 'I hope you don't have babies". See the imbalance there? There are none so deaf as those that refuse to hear. 'i feel you are being unfair' 'what a mess your life is'. OK i paraphrase but that red zone comes into play at the slightest banter. I concede Diacanu calling you a cunt was also wrong but this in no way excuses your own strange and disproportionate vitriol.
Atheistjon, thanks for your considered posts.

205. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #137106 by mikejswalker on March 2, 2008 at 11:04 am

How is asking someone to do us all a favour by not breeding furthering the argument about gun control?
Let's debate. Not wear our sensitivities like an easily bruised second skin when our points get challenged.
When i said i detected a history here i was not aware of how deep it went. Someone got challenged. It went deep. That much is painfully obvious.

206. Fleabytes

Comment #136752 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 4:26 pm

quine,
could've been fun tho.... (walks away, hands in pockets, kicks a stone....)

207. Fleabytes

Comment #136736 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 4:15 pm

frankus, wine and antibiotics. Excuse me.

208. Fleabytes

Comment #136717 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 4:00 pm

man, why don't we have a debate where one team have to take on the religious argument and the other the atheist. I mean it'll be a claw sharpener for future ref since those religionists are closing in on us so fast. How wierd for them to come back to this site and see us debating their debate better than they can.
Man that's just so childish. Wine and antibiotics. Don't do it.

209. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #136709 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 3:45 pm

i agree a person can do as much damage with a car as a handgun but a gun is so much easier to lift.
One reason for getting rid of guns is it stimulates the creative side of killing.

210. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #136458 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 9:01 am

anger sensitivity gun=danger. Not deserving of anymore interaction. I'll take liberal fascist over fascist any day.

211. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #136418 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 6:07 am

Comment #15915 by scooternyc on January 3, 2007 at 7:52 pm

''Having worked as a therapist for several years, I can tell you that verbal/mental/emotional abuse is more damaging at times than physical abuse."
Steve Z,
if your intention is to wind him up, then that is a drag. But i feel it isn't that. Correct me if i'm wrong. So please do not take any weight for such a terrible comment. If scooter has any balls he'll apologise unreservedly, and take heed of his own comment at the top of this post.

212. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #136413 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 5:46 am

Sensitivity and guns. lethal combination.
Sharon- apologies on behalf of all of us.
Scooter, for so many reasons, that was a lame comment. You should apologise.

213. US Treaty with Tripoli

Comment #136409 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 5:30 am

The joy of watching an anger missile stop at the target, confused and a little out of place. I sense a history here.

214. Fleabytes

Comment #136375 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 3:01 am

Hello hello,
i don't know why you say goodbye, i say hello.
These guys together present a formidable team, and most trolls come and go having been shown the error of arguments not thought thru.
Even tho your effort was slightly lame you should stick around.
Much to learn here for those that are open.

215. Fleabytes

Comment #136372 by mikejswalker on March 1, 2008 at 2:50 am

It's unfortunate to have lost one of the guys because of a lame comment. It was indeed in poor taste and Steve z had nothing to apologise for when he made that point.

NMcC, you should dust yourself down and get back on track with your usual erudition.
The name calling etc is seldom funny and my bleet from the start was that it was troll ammo and we should not be baited.
Buffy stuff etc i find amusing because it's like an intermission where we rest and play awhile.
For the record, if a point is sincerely expressed, don't assume it is said to make you/us angry. That it does, is beside the point.
It might be said (and probably is) from a position of complete sincerity. So, it deserves our respect, and should be, as many religionist ideas, dismissed with grace.

216. Fleabytes

Comment #136203 by mikejswalker on February 29, 2008 at 2:16 pm

the circle game oh the circle game. I did not ask to be put here. on earth. Now my arse is toast. even if i tried, i could't believe.
I just can't. It has never been in me. My kids are the same.
Why put me here, knowing this would be the case?
If i ever meet you, on the back of the trade winds, you should wear a testicle gaurd.

217. Fleabytes

Comment #136126 by mikejswalker on February 29, 2008 at 1:19 pm

Like a priest with a pornagraphic watch, looking and longing on the sly, sure it's stricken from your uniform, but you can't get it out of your eye.

218. Fleabytes

Comment #135572 by mikejswalker on February 29, 2008 at 5:23 am

Brian,
Not possible. couldn't lift it. Bucket too big.

219. Fleabytes

Comment #135562 by mikejswalker on February 29, 2008 at 5:11 am

If a religionist was on a hill basking in the glory of the lord, and suddenly noticed a small 3 year old girl walking toward the edge of the cliff, Something would kick him off his arse and send him running toward her. And if God appeared and stood in his way, the guy would run thru him to get to her. A mother would go to hell in place of her kids. A love that would die for another, knowing it was never going to be resurrected, is a far greater love than anything Religion has to offer.

220. Fleabytes

Comment #135539 by mikejswalker on February 29, 2008 at 4:36 am

Hi,
I'm 30. Just trying to find out what life is about.
Is life really empty like atheists say or is God getting us ready for the infinite praise fest.. If there truly is a god what was His thinking
behind the creation of the budgie. I'm so confused.

221. Fleabytes

Comment #135152 by mikejswalker on February 28, 2008 at 3:29 pm

If David asked genuine questions and opened up a little like Pmurdoch we could have a proper debate with him. It's such a shame. Lessons can be learned here.

222. Fleabytes

Comment #135144 by mikejswalker on February 28, 2008 at 3:18 pm

I mean Diacanu.

223. Fleabytes

Comment #135141 by mikejswalker on February 28, 2008 at 3:15 pm

mike,
now your being ironic right.?
Irony duel?

224. Fleabytes

Comment #135135 by mikejswalker on February 28, 2008 at 3:06 pm

I really don't think a religionist would be so manipulative as to pretend to be something they were not. That they would deal in such falsity just isn't credible. Also, i don't believe for a second that a religionist would be so desperate or immature.

225. Fleabytes

Comment #134556 by mikejswalker on February 28, 2008 at 1:47 am

Hi David,
i'll give a whole 4 pound note (i mean it) if you make a genuine attempt to answer epeeists question.

Holdsworth, Sand, killer playing. legato genius. Strings too light so not enough air in sound. But beautiful, so to speak.

226. Fleabytes

Comment #134363 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 4:22 pm

free blind mikes, see....

No-one with long hair would do the hell thing to anyone, and every picture i've seen either he's got long hair or she's got a beard.

When the coil is shuffled, and you find yourself standing before God, seriously, what would you say?

227. Fleabytes

Comment #134336 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 3:54 pm

Hell is is the silliest human consruct of all time. I actually find it funny. 'ahh but we thought of that in the contruction, 10 mins in the furnace of unbearable pain then 10 minutes in the skin revitaliser forever and ever and ever and ever and ever and ever more and more'. Love me or burn is bang on. Heaven is a happy place. All those people floating around with thoughts of loved ones, who just happened to be atheists, burning away. Let's toast the toasted. It goes well Brian. You?

228. Fleabytes

Comment #134317 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 3:19 pm

He comes. gives the revolving door a push. Then leaves. And then watches all that intellect spin. All that wordplay. Wasted.

229. Fleabytes

Comment #134157 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 10:41 am

Pmurdock,
what Al says,
'So while you are destructing each of those points, most of which boil down to subtle ad homs, you are too busy to deal with the real issue, which is this brand of theism has no stable tenets. It is a public facade to continue believing fairytale nonsense at home', is really not an exaggeration. It's bang on.
What do you feel about it?

230. Fleabytes

Comment #134119 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 9:26 am

Best leave it to the 'old' guys. They can word the questions with much greater authority.

231. Fleabytes

Comment #134093 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 8:33 am

ok, the effort was there. It would indeed be a miracle if we had 2 minutes silence without interruption at a football match. So the best thing maybe is to lift the self imposed ban, pat each other on the back occasionally with the odd 'fuck this, it's like debating a sponge pudding' and resign ourselves to how tough it is not to cast that stone when the target is so easy.
Maybe we could try something. Their seems to be a control issue.
Maybe if we all seperately, in our own words, ask him to answer epeeists question about the tenets of fundamental atheism, we might get him to a place where dignity exists.
What i am all to aware of is the possibilty that he goes away laughing each time he provokes a certain obvious response, then says 'want to see some athiest vitriol, just watch this'. like a lonely boy poking a hornets nest at the bottom of his garden.
I apologise for labouring the point, but silence to his 'confused
debating technique' (i know how irate atheist feels) would kill with kindness. I realise in the face of such 'confused debating technique' that this is nigh on impossible. Plus the added notion that some actually enjoy the sport.

232. Fleabytes

Comment #133959 by mikejswalker on February 27, 2008 at 4:12 am

Dave,
The 'ashamed' comment was dumb. This kind of comment tells everyone about the real effect Paula's article has had on you. Knee jerk comments that are given with a false wry smile just smack of desperation. I don't say you feel desperate, but you certainly give that impression each time you reach down for the 'mud'.
Also it does feel that if i came to your house for a cup of tea that there would be copies of your book strategically placed all over the house.
Somebody said you might be schizophrenic, which is rude to both you and schizophrenics. You take offence and then call someone a lunatic.

Now, be a love, and answer epeeists point;
What are the fundamental athiest dogmas, tenets or creed?

233. Fleabytes

Comment #133544 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 10:45 am

ta for that steve. i heard it in an Al Jarreau song that goes 'i know i can/ like any man/ reach out my hand/ and touch the face of god.
Different sentiments i know but i feel at best lukewarm to both poem and song.

Frankus,
i'm so glad i helped raise a chuckle but discouraged that you're leading your lambs into the ways of darkness and depravity. I hope you told them laura was eventually saved.
seriously, i could not agree more with your statement concerning student learning. These are the qualities that allow them to embrace their own mistakes, and readily shed old opinions when better ones come along.

234. Pakistan blocks YouTube over blasphemous video

Comment #133534 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 10:01 am

Anyway,
i'm sure y'all get the point by now. Allotments are the world in micro.

235. Fleabytes

Comment #133506 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 9:03 am

Frankus,
for your perusal. www.ishipress.com/drlaura.htm -
People can change their values i guess.

236. Pakistan blocks YouTube over blasphemous video

Comment #133492 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 8:38 am

Freedom of speech carries great responsibility.
I don't agree in the least with the author of the piece from le courrier but i am interested in the lines and how they get crossed or smudged depending on where one is standing at the time.
Harris Hitchens and dawkins have spoken at length about this.
People get incited to kill others in road rage and have been killed for nothing more than being on the wrong football team.
The lines often blur between gentle national pride and nationalistic tendencies. This sometimes happens in pubs where gentle banter about potatoes turns into age old famine fights.
People are passionate about their garden plot. My next door neighbour moved my bin about 6 inches over toward my house, away from her house.
And she'll watch TV that night and shake her head and wonder why so many die for land.
Things are never simple. Snow drops under microscopes.
Mike

237. Pakistan blocks YouTube over blasphemous video

Comment #133398 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 6:51 am

Horrid when one tries to post and it just disappears. It gives me a fleeting feeling of boo hoo.
2nd time lucky.......

This is from a paper in Geneva called Le Courrier.

"You would have thought the danes had tired of being the target of Islamic rage. Apparently not. Jyllands Posten, the paper which three years ago published a cartoon of the prophet Mohammed with a ticking bomb on his head - inflaming Muslim opinion throughout the world-has gone and reprinted it. Not only that, all of Denmark's other main newspapers have printed it too. The editors say they are protesting the recently discovered plot by islamic terrorists to kill the artist responsible for the cartoon, Kurt Westergaard, and sending a signal that attacks on free expression "won't be tolerated".
Fine sentiments, but is this really a good idea? The terrorists failed to throw petrol on the flames; now the danes are doing the job fo them. It's disasterous for the vast majority of muslims in Denmark, who just want a quiet life, and will now again ave to quieten the fanatics in their midst.Couldn't the papers have found a more 'subtle' way to make their point, without having to insult the whole of islam? Let's stand firm against terror, but not at the risk of "falling back into a sterile confrontation between an ultra-touchy Islam and an arrogant west".


Are their ever any merits to keeping quiet or being more 'subtle' about oppression and injustice? I ask this seriously, as a point of genuine discussion.
Mike

238. Fleabytes

Comment #133270 by mikejswalker on February 26, 2008 at 2:14 am

frankus,
That is a brilliant scene. Jennifer Jacobs is a smile in the face fundamentalist and he uses bible quotes to show her hypocrisy and bigotry.
His god is the more private loving etc god. Not the god of the bible.
But when he starts cackin on about touching the face of god with lush strings in the background i close my eyes.
BTW, I wonder if that character is based on Anne coulter or some other fundie.

239. Fleabytes

Comment #133089 by mikejswalker on February 25, 2008 at 3:26 pm

Yes i remember vinnick being an athiest and the problems around that. I'm also well aware of the character of Bartlett's belief but the beautiful orchestral arrangements behind those 'touch the face of God' lines is a bit toe curling amidst such jaw dropping scripts don't ya think steve?

240. Fleabytes

Comment #133082 by mikejswalker on February 25, 2008 at 3:17 pm

i have just read an enormous thread that is a credit to this site.
Great debate between Billy Mark etc. learned so much and was glad that epithets were few and far between and largely dealt with gracefully. Brilliant read.

241. Fleabytes

Comment #133075 by mikejswalker on February 25, 2008 at 3:10 pm

I'm watching the whole seven series of the west wing for the second time. Beautiful writing. But there are a couple of wincers where Bartlett says stuff like 'we can stretch out our fingers and touch the face of God'. Why do they do that? It's beyond me.
off topic i know but my selfishness made me share it.

242. The coming religious peace

Comment #132206 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 1:06 pm

Richard,
Absolutely. When we fully understand that, we can debate from the stronger position of understanding. For instance, i can congratulate richard on the relatively ok performance of his team and i'm sure he would congratulate me on the almost gazelle like coupled with nerves of steele thrashing of the french. It's just gentle folk locked in the warm embrace of debate.

243. Richard Dawkins on five of his favorite books

Comment #132186 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 12:33 pm

fave books.
The Bible.
another Bible.
a big bible.
Pole dancing in Ruskin country.
How to really really really.

244. Fleabytes

Comment #132127 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 9:11 am

epeeist,
i agree that this is a more than formidable team. If i was religious in any way i would think twice about posting here. Also the humour, and obvious banter is refreshing.
But i have seen people here get pissed off with like minded thinkers because they start referring to others as 'prissy' or 'whackjobs' etc. Now, i can see this as a little light hearted banter but when certain people are being cornered by the logic from all angles of the people here, we should not take that bait when it is thrown. We should stick to the topic when debating him. Don't give him any chance whatsoever of avoiding an important point by referring to our droll name calling etc.
When i was a prof in weimar there was a fascist rally.
The students organised themselves and when the fascists walked down a particular street, the students hung speakers outside the windows and played brazilian samba music.
If ever the combined movement of alternating raised legs looked funnier i have yet to experience it.

kind regards
Mike

245. Fleabytes

Comment #132121 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 8:26 am

lorien,
"I hope your right. Although many like Robertson depend on their own bullshit for their livelyhood, so even if he (in the deep recesses of his mind) did agree with you, do you really think he's just going to up and leave his job and adoring congregation? From what I've seen and heard about this chap I smell disingenuous, like Alister McGrath. By the way, I'm from Australia, so certain language is commonplace, even as a greeting! "

Mike,
I'm hoping so too. I don't think he'll agree. It would take a huge amount of balls to drag himself from underneath the heavy shadow of inculcation, religious indoctrination (self imposed or otherwise) to finally, and seriously, take on some of the logic presented in these threads. I'd like to ask an open question.
Does anyone believe he does not sincerely believe what he says he does?
Finally, i understand cultural colloquiallisms have their place, but i just feel we should be more selective when we choose to use them here. i totally get they are relatively harmless, but they get used to dodge the point, and when i'm reading this stuff thru, that get's frustrating.

246. Fleabytes

Comment #132116 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 8:09 am

cheers peace,
I see. I guess this site is full of people who have not given any of this a moments thought since it began. A strange logic.
So bizarre i waded thru this whole thread! I must have missed a page. merci, mike.

247. Fleabytes

Comment #132111 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 7:38 am

peace,
where can i find krisskrings inflammatory remarks?
cheers, mike

248. Fleabytes

Comment #132086 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 5:53 am

Freedom of speech is indeed a wonderful thing lorien and i do feel that david fuels anger here, i don't think it's just me projecting, but i could be wrong. I read all of these posts and some, and i just think reverting to 'dickhead' hands him the weapons he desires.
He has been welcomed back by Richard (ok 'welcomed' is a bit strong) and i think we should quietly and assuredly and confidently and smartly give him enough rope.
No matter what he uses to hurt us. It's important to give him the chance (i know, yet again) to let him hear the echo of his own vacuous opinions.

249. Fleabytes

Comment #132078 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 5:19 am

lorien,
As a plain 'n' simple observer, that just does not work. It never has and never will. Did you know he was a 'dickhead' before you watched the youtube vid? If so, what is the point of watching. To fuel an anger you're already geared up to feel? I just read the thread on bart ehrman and it happens there. People kind of self aggrandising thru mockery. It feels churlish and a little pointless when one reads such posts.

kind regards
'some here'.

250. Fleabytes

Comment #132054 by mikejswalker on February 24, 2008 at 3:50 am

Can we keep David on topic? Ignore the fluff.
Not give him a chance to ignore our points by referring to our anger. Invective and mundane epithets get used to defend a position that is spurious at best. Also people of all persuasions should be encouraged to come here and debate these issues.
As an observer i always feel a little stab of disappointment when things get personal.
I found myself wincing when someone called steve z"prissy" but was encouraged when he typically ignored it.
Paula seems to do this well. She always addresses the salient points. She gives credit where it's due. She doesn't give wriggle room.
Kind regards,
Mike