251. Two More Fleas

Comment #144157 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 8:17 am

The assertion that the universe was fine-tuned is largely promoted by advocates of intelligent design and other forms of creationism. The apparent fine-tuning of the universe is cited as evidence for the existence of God or some form of intelligence capable of manipulating (or designing) the basic physics that governs the universe- so when that phrase is used it seems religious to me!

252. Two More Fleas

Comment #144064 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 2:14 am

Regarding the "anthropomorphic principle" - I prefer to refer to it as the anthropic princple - if you consider the possiblity that there are multiple buble universes then we just happen to be in one in which life is possible- one in perhaps an infinite number...

It all goes back to your "fine tuning" argument.(for which I don't think there is one)

I know that for the big bang to have happend (without our current knowledge of quantum physics) the universe had to be initially perfect so that the constants are like they are...(sort of like a pencil so difficult to balance and that the most slight influence would have inbalanced)but we know that inflation happend due to the existence of dark energy and entropy. (and the entropy agrument is quite convincing!)

Anymore there is no fine tuning argument and the best physicists agree. (including Steven Pollock, Brian Greene, and Amir Aczel)

I don't even PRETEND to be a know it all (I have so much to learn!)- but I just have heard so many arguments against the fine tuning argument that I am convinced...(there is NO argument)

253. Two More Fleas

Comment #144061 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 2:01 am

Steve on another note I want to talk about your whole "fine tuning argument" that you mention frequently..

First of all after hearing lecture after lecture by Brian Greene and also several other physicists- for there to be a fine tuning their first had to be a fine tuner - I don't agree- instead I accept inflation- it seems to be the best explanation of the facts in so far as we know them at this point - In fact - there is no fine tuning argument - only and unless you think there was a tuner- which I'm sure you will agree is not a scientific thing to think - It is more parsimonious to say that you don't know the information WAY before you say there was any type of argument for "fine tuning"

Also I want to say that inflation pretty much explains the arrow of time and entropy. If in the beginning of time there was a microfluctuation that was 1x10^-80 centimeters in the obvious quantum vaccuum that would be all that was necessary to start inflation ( there being a field that fluctuates back and forth wildly which is common even in the smallest of spaces). There being the opposite of gravity during inflation (sort of anti-gravity but not in the most popular idea)which spread all particles out into an almost perfect homogenity (yet still leaving random imperfections)- then gravity took over and coelesced the remaining particles into stars and galaxies... I'm sure you've heard the argument before -

I am really tired of hearing the idea that there is some sort of weight behind the "fine tuning" argument - it is not scientific - even referring to it as if it is an argument gives it weight - Instead it would be more logical to say that if inflation didn't occur and the constants are the way they are that there must be an explanation for why they didn't wildly change way before our current epoc.

Inflation explains all of this all the way back to quantum fluctuations (which is what you see when you see the way matter has clumped into it's current state over billions of years)

254. Two More Fleas

Comment #144051 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 1:38 am

Steve - the fact that you already live in the house or else you wouldn't ask the question is kind of potent

255. I don't believe in atheists

Comment #144048 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 1:33 am

Does anyone not agree that he misuses the word fundamentlist?---

(Chris Hedges)

256. I don't believe in atheists

Comment #144047 by robotaholic on March 15, 2008 at 1:24 am

Harris is right in criticizing Islam in the way that he does. You don't have to be a "leprocholigist" to know that leprochaunism is wrong... I think you know what I mean...

257. I don't believe in atheists

Comment #143812 by robotaholic on March 14, 2008 at 12:56 pm

I think the man needs to familiarize himself with the definition of fundamentalism.


A belief in the infallibility, and literal interpretation, of a particular religion's doctrine or holy books. ...


a movement that sees itself opposed to Modernism, stressing the infallibility of the Bible in both religious matters and historical accuracy


Fundamentalism is the belief in absolute religious authority and the demand that this religious authority be legally enforced. Often, fundamentalism involves the willingness to do battle for one's faith. ...


uncritical acceptance of revealed truth and willingness to follow a leader embodying authority


A term originally applied to conservative, Bible-centered Protestant Christians (many of whom now prefer to call themselves "evangelicals"), but more recently extended to apply to the religiously authoritarian of all sorts (including classical Christians, Jews, and Muslims)


predominately a form of American Protestant Christianity wich lays especial emphasis on the authority of the inerrant Bible.


and this is my favorite:

the interpretation of every word in the sacred texts as literal truth

By the fact that he even used the word to describe atheists (of whom the definition is that they don't have a belief in a deity) he clearly demonstrates he doesn't know what it means!!!

258. Fleabytes

Comment #143258 by robotaholic on March 13, 2008 at 7:00 pm

Steve, that OMG particle link was awesome - THX!

259. Bishop accuses gays of 'conspiracy' against the Catholic Church

Comment #143249 by robotaholic on March 13, 2008 at 6:36 pm

You know we've tried peace with the Catholic Church for years, we should give force a chance...

260. Bishop accuses gays of 'conspiracy' against the Catholic Church

Comment #143098 by robotaholic on March 13, 2008 at 12:48 pm

The Catholic Church is always saying something. They've just turned into background noise to me... I'm as far away from them as is possible to be I think and I work right next to a catholic parish lol

Islam gets all the attention anymore and I really loved Pat Condell's recent video called "Appeasing Islam"- he was breathtakingly articulate! I think it's here http://youtube.com/watch?v=y9dXGJ2rYdA

261. Deadly Sins 101

Comment #143092 by robotaholic on March 13, 2008 at 12:39 pm

Having zero impact on the environment seems impossible. I'm gonna invest in the manufacturers of biocontainment suits and gas masks lol Mabye in heaven I can take off my mask.

262. Special Guest: Richard Dawkins

Comment #142570 by robotaholic on March 12, 2008 at 6:55 pm

Yeah I didn't care for the music but it is always good to hear Richard Dawkins - and also - it is kind of good that they preserved the whole show- or at least most of the show- the good thing about it being a download is that you can foreward through the parts you don't like-

Professor Richard Dawkins was kind of having a great time- I enjoyed hearing him laugh and having a great time...

263. Fleabytes

Comment #142049 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 7:14 pm

Atheists can't know that there are no gods. We also can't know that there aren't any other mystical beings ( leprechauns ) - I really like Dawkins argument that "we all are atheists- just some of us go just one god further"

264. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #142034 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 4:27 pm

I also think men should have the ability to deactivate their sperm, extra-corporeally.

265. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #142028 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 4:11 pm

well I still think that lust shouldn't be a deadly sin- It has too many unpacked options- and also...You are a profound writer...that is nice- I hope that in the future people wont consider lust for "saving the environment" a bad thing- but sexual lust seriously shouldn't be wrong for VARIOUS reasons - first of all we are supposed to procreate (Genesis 1:28) and second of all if we had no drive to do so- we wouldn't exist - how can a creator of humans expect us to not act like he (it) expected?

The various sins...are nonsense obviously but trying to logically consider them is probably the fault in the first place

My question remains seriously - how can a created person be expected to not act like their formulated self-

I think I'm an eliminative materialist and I don't think there are such things are hopes, desires, wishes...the reason being that they can't make sense when you try to analize human relationships...

Today I was at the zoo- and he great apes were so humanoid- I honestly think that people who think that we're different from them havn't seen them -FACT

266. Fleabytes

Comment #142020 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 3:34 pm

Keith - no - everyone retained their genetalia

267. Fleabytes

Comment #142018 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 3:30 pm

well Its not like I'm just dying or anything - I just know I have an issue with drinking - and it's so EASY TO DO! Liquor stores are EVERYWHERE! lol - but I see other people on their days off go and do things and I just sit here...computering lol - But thx so much you guys -

On a different note - the large Galapagos Turtles were nothing like Dawkins's recent video - they were all just sitting there with their backsides in view and wouldn't move - I know they don't move often lol but I have a fondness for turtles- the large kind- and this zoo trip today sort of disappointed me- and at the same time - it was great because it was 72 today here at the Oklahoma City Zoo and it's still beautiful today- yes I type with dashes all the time- That's how I type lol -

Serious question - what do you guys do with your spare time- how do you not get beers or booze?- what else do you do? - and is that an addiction in itself?

and also - I'm irrited in this site that I have to continually sign in over and over - what can be done about that - I use opera, Internet Explorer, and Firefox- but still i have to sign in over and over- It's not that bad seriously- but other sites are not like this one

268. Fleabytes

Comment #142014 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 3:24 pm

Epeeist thx alot - I think the solution at least in my case is learning how to deal with being sober - sounds dumb I know - but honestly when I have a free day and nothing is going on - drinking always rears it's ugly head- To be forced to deal with sobriety will be my solution-

I had back surgery a few yrs ago and was prescribed oxycontin and I took it as prescribed...but eventually (after 23 days) I realized I couldn't quit taking it - and so then I had to deal with withdrawal (which was horrible of course)- I know this alcohol problem is not similar- alcohol is not a withdrawal issue - instead it's all about relaxing with time on my hands and not getting alcohol to have fun.... Honestly dealing with being sober and just sitting here is the hardest part... I'm sure you know what I mean-

269. Fleabytes

Comment #142008 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 3:08 pm

Richard Morgan - I have an apointment with the doctor next week to get antabuse. I am quitting drinking forever hopefully soon - I have tried to quit on my own but all my friends do it so i get-you know what- no - I do it when im alone too - I am going to get on that drug and it takes like 2 weeks to get out of your system (which i like) - so therefore I can't even plan....to get drunk

Mind you I know eventually I'll be off it yrs later but mabye by then I'll be able to deal with boredom without alcohol-

Most of my friends are like "Comeone man - just drink on your days off and recover before work-" but I know ME - I tend to do it every few days - so I really think this medicine "quote unquote" will help me...

anyway wish me luck -

270. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #142005 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 2:57 pm

Teratornis you were putting lust in explicitly sexual terms- and the word doesn't necessarily require sex but as noted above that was a great post. And I know that you know it's not always in reference to sex.

Do you think that the biblical reference to lust was explicitly sexual? If so I understand what you mean and agree...However we both know that it isn't necessarily in reference to sex today...and so therefore it is gramatically sort of inaccurate to equate lust with doing something "wrong" even in the classical sense.

Still great post. I understand more. And thank you. To paraphrase (hopefully i got your point)...It turns you away from the worshipfull attitude you should always have toward your god...or at least diverts your attention...

Still my question though is if you were in a what doesnt' belong questionaire- wouldn't you choose lust as what doesn't belong? (in the 7 deadly sins) - mabye there should be 6 lol

271. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #141979 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 1:51 pm

Geoff- you have the funniest comments sometimes.

and I'm a total Lovecraft Fanatic.- I have audiobooks of like everything and all his stories of course in book form - and several books with spinoff stories based on his works - he really was an eloquent writer - one of the best I've ever read- he made fiction not at all amateur-

I say this because I assume that is Cthulhu lol - and also that Pharyngula blog guy - he's a fan too - I just got back from the zoo today and i took a million pictures- the aquatic exhibit was awesome - from Sea Lion to Cuttlefish (btw i couldn't even find the cuttlefish it was so well camouflaged)- we had a great time - the best thing was when my friend Trevor was standing behind the glass looking at a gurilla while it was walking by and it turned and stood right there face to face with him and staired at him right in the eyes and i got a snapshop of it on my blackberry - im gonna post them on myspace soon-it was so creepy i got chills- anyway I wanted to ask if they had any unicorns or dragons on display- cuz i read my bible ya know... lol

272. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #141977 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 1:47 pm

sure, i have a lust to be nice to people- I have a lust to be successfull - in the sexual arena - to which i wasn't necessarily referring- yeah it has- I mean this may be tmi but I dont have sex with anyone unless i'm in love- mabye that explains a bit - but honestly lust is a good thing it seems to me - the lust to be productive at work- in scientific fields- I guess lust to murder people is bad - but that is not related to the lust - that's related to the wrongness of the act-

Lust in itself just seems like intentional extreme desire- what that is focused on is what is important...

anyway, it doesn't belong in the 7 deadly sins list if you ask me- it's like saying love is bad- just because you can love to kill people -

I am a wordy person and not on purpose - i just am - and in an iq test where they say "what doesn't belong in this list" i would select lust

273. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #141963 by robotaholic on March 11, 2008 at 1:28 pm

will someone please explain to me what is so wrong with lust? I mean I don't understand the logic in treating it as sinfull. Can anyone really say they never have lust and that having lust is bad? I don't mean just sexually (even though mabye that's what the bible is talking about)- but honestly- what is wrong with lust?
You shouldn't be out of balance with it obviously - balance is a good thing - but to completely not allow lust in your life seems like it would make you an unhealthy person...
Does that make any sense?- mabye someone who's read the bible more times than I can shead some light on it-

274. Should Galileo's tomb be opened for DNA tests?

Comment #141582 by robotaholic on March 10, 2008 at 6:13 pm

The Catholic Church is anti-science - no matter what the situation is-

275. Seven new deadly sins: are you guilty?

Comment #141579 by robotaholic on March 10, 2008 at 6:05 pm

Has anybody ever noticed that televangelists sit in gold thrones and wear tons of jewelry and beg for money?

http://www.allhatnocattle.net/tbn pat.jpg

...and the people who give them money are just pittiful-

276. Fleabytes

Comment #141404 by robotaholic on March 10, 2008 at 11:04 am

I'm wondering when/if Richard's tour stops will be televised (salivates)

277. Oklahoma: One Step from Doom

Comment #141058 by robotaholic on March 9, 2008 at 11:03 pm

oh wow - i am in norman from OU and wow- oklahoma is kind of cool but not this

278. Fleabytes

Comment #141031 by robotaholic on March 9, 2008 at 5:43 pm

I love his music too - the composition is great-

ov course every compliment comes with it's own plug - as in visit my myspace music page - i made everything myself from scratch - no theivery lol
www.myspace.com/sensoryassault :p

-edit

of course it's not dedicated to you...[yet]

I'm going to do a musical mess with text from fleabytes read by robot voices lol!!- because of course it was so inspiring

279. Out of the Blue

Comment #141024 by robotaholic on March 9, 2008 at 5:15 pm

hey Richard Morgan - check out my myspace music page - i have been making music now for 15 yrs and I'm called Sensory Assault - I make it on my computer too - but it's not midi - it's all waves and samples

www.myspace.com/sensoryassault

I change my name all the time like right now it's "self preventing prophesy" lol

anyway tell me what you think oh and add me - not my music myspace but my regular one www.myspace.com/robotaholic

OXOX

280. Out of the Blue

Comment #141017 by robotaholic on March 9, 2008 at 4:59 pm

It seems to me that the real complexity in consciousness arises from like Douglas R. Hofstadter says looking at yourself or inner reflection... and he likens it to looking in a mirror and seeing your reflection when you have a mirror behind you and you reflect continually. He has a really great book called "I am a strange Loop" and I just love it- it's sort of meandering and the first half is really anecdotal but the last half is interesting. I could be wrong but I believe it's his 2nd book about consciousness with of course The Eternal Braid - The Goedel Escher Bach book... He wrote the Mind's Eye with Daniel Dennett long ago but i have it in pdf if anyone wants it - I recommend it! It really touches on many of the ideas in this article or at least many of the comments - especially the comment earlier about allowing a slower processor and hence a time delay in order to replicate 1 second of human consciousness...In The Mind's I Dennet has this story where he has a brain in one place and a body in another or even his consciousness is split up into different spatial locations and so where is "HE"? It's great reading funnnnn!!! Anyway if anyone wants that paper I'd be happy to zip it and email it it's great.

281. Out of the Blue

Comment #140840 by robotaholic on March 8, 2008 at 6:38 pm

This is the best lolcat I have seen in a while
http://i26.tinypic.com/11a8nkm.jpg

282. Out of the Blue

Comment #140836 by robotaholic on March 8, 2008 at 6:24 pm

Allow me...an expert on robotics...lol joking

I do hope we can make a brain cuz that would enable us to make a better Whopper!

283. Fleabytes

Comment #140563 by robotaholic on March 7, 2008 at 9:39 pm

How come no matter how many posts i make it always says im a lurker or a newbie- i have lol obviously posted a billion times- am i doing something wrong? any clues?

284. Fleabytes

Comment #140561 by robotaholic on March 7, 2008 at 9:33 pm

omg Mr. Alan Turing HA hA is all I have to say - that post must have taken a billlllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllion years lmfao-

285. Fleabytes

Comment #140551 by robotaholic on March 7, 2008 at 8:47 pm

-last comment- Richard Dawkins was on NPR today from 7 to 8 pm on 3/7/08 tonight. He was magnificent. He had an instant answer to every question. It was hosted by Terry Gross- I enjoyed every word he said - he was absolutely accurate and he was conversational and I really think it reached at least thousands of americans coming home from work and the like...

I hope it ends up on this website as a link- it was great.

286. Fleabytes

Comment #140550 by robotaholic on March 7, 2008 at 8:42 pm

Steve ZZZZZ - I honestly think you play "devils advocate" much more than you have to! - You're just difficult (and I mean that in the utmost affectionate way)

-john

287. Fleabytes

Comment #140549 by robotaholic on March 7, 2008 at 8:39 pm

Paula Kirby, I respect you so much. To get back on topic, your review was objectively profound. I appreciated how you were honest about the topics of which you knew little about and how you expounded on the subjects in which you had ample resources. I think you seriously can write...!

I have reread "Fleabytes" four times. I think you did justice to the books you reviewed. I have skimmed several at Borders and again felt "white noise" when reading them. I just want to say that similar to what Dawkins said in TGD you're review "filled a much needed gap" but in a different way. I think you might know what I mean.

This thread has really been amazing in so many subjects...

Most of the people on this sight are so clear in what they say. I am happy to have this website to read every day. This community is truely refreshing. Most people that I meet don't care to talk about subjects that are really of important-at least to me...

Thanks again Paula Kirby

-John

288. Lords Approve Abolition Of Blasphemy

Comment #139745 by robotaholic on March 6, 2008 at 1:00 pm

Comment #139683 by Ultraviolet G:

Dear Britain, what the hell is a "house of lords"??

Signed, the 21st century.

289. Crossing the Divide

Comment #139732 by robotaholic on March 6, 2008 at 12:49 pm

this was a great article

290. The Salamander's Tale

Comment #139442 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 8:55 pm

if the earth were created in 4004bc then we wouldn't even have tree rings right...

291. Christopher Hitchens on Real Time with Bill Maher

Comment #139438 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 8:46 pm

i was just referring to this website's reference an a clear-thinking oasis... and I'm not going to define clear thinking...it pretty much means what it means...but here is Bodhi and it's the opposit of clear-thinking

a buddha is generally considered to be a person who discovers the true nature of reality through (lifetimes of) spiritual cultivation, investigation of the various religious practices of his time, and meditation. This transformational discovery is called Bodhi, which literally means "awakening", but is more commonly called "enlightenment".

If you ask me Rebirth and Karma both seem as far away from clear-thinking as crystal power... lol

292. Christopher Hitchens on Real Time with Bill Maher

Comment #139433 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 8:17 pm

qster can you see the top of this page "A Clear Thinking Oasis"- reincarnation is not reasonable nor is it clear thinking

How long can you talk about nothing?

293. Christopher Hitchens on Real Time with Bill Maher

Comment #139428 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 8:02 pm

I voted for Hillary Clinton and sent her 50.00. To me, you're obligated to vote for the person with the best resume. For any other job you are anyway...She objectively has the best resume. We should get out of Iraq, have universal health care, and support gay marriage. We should have alternative energy sources, help preserve the environment and try to raise the living standards of less fortunate people. lol We should not bomb or invade other countries if at all possible. We should instead invest in medicine (like stem cell research)and science in general as well as science education...and we should smile more! and hug people more often lol

294. Fleabytes

Comment #139427 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 7:55 pm

I know this is off the topic of the original thread...but honestly it's terrible to read religious literature. It's agonizing. I have tried to watch debates between say Christopher Hitchens and his christian counterparts and when it gets to the christian apologist I totally glaze over and feel like I'm listening white noise. I want to pin down the "spiritual person" and ask them please point to heaven...please identify a human soul...please tell me why you feel the need to "worship" someone- just that word "worship" seems alien to me and just about perverted.

295. Christopher Hitchens on Real Time with Bill Maher

Comment #139422 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 7:30 pm

ok sure, I made it up

296. Christopher Hitchens on Real Time with Bill Maher

Comment #139413 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 7:00 pm

wow I totally agree, monks and buddhists get a free ride on this website and I can't see why! (almost as bad as the media hating Hillary Clinton and liking Obama)

297. Fleabytes

Comment #139410 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 6:52 pm

I've read Elbow Room. Definitely. I don't remember much because sometimes he's not very conversational. It sometimes get monotonous. But I do remember "What RoboMary Knows" and enjoyed it immensely.

298. Fleabytes

Comment #139408 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 6:48 pm

I suggest you read more about hypnosis and free will. There have been many experiments where for example someone will hypnotise a guy to jump on the floor when he hears the word "Germany" and later someone will say I want to visit Germany. And right then the gentleman jumps on the floor and says "ya know, I've always wanted to get into the Tile business...mabye sell tiles...or possibly even manufacture them" -all the while thinking he jumped on the floor of his own free will because he's interested in tile producing when the cause was unknown by the individual.

I hope I made myself clear. Also, I think people justify their actions by "looking backwards" and making sense of their actions when in reality they have no clue as to what drives them to: think up a completely random thought, or a new creative idea..etc etc etc I'm sure you get my point.

299. Fleabytes

Comment #139405 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 6:42 pm

so we are originators of our actions in a deterministic universe since we're functional- ?

just because none of the elements which comprises your body can accomplish what your body fully formulated can doesn't mean that you have free will-?

If the links in the temporal chain of causation that happen is us are necessary then how do we get to choose anything?

No offense, - I enjoy the topic, but I don't really understand any of what you just said except of course

The links in the temporal chain of causation that happen in us are necessary.

300. Fleabytes

Comment #139403 by robotaholic on March 5, 2008 at 6:27 pm

1. Actions are events.
2. Every event has a cause.
3 If an event is caused, then it is causally determined.
4. If an event is an act that is causally determined, then the agent of the act could not have acted otherwise than in the way that she did.

I don't see how free will is compatible with this.